Problem with a Keston Celcius 25

[Jack155Q4]

Dear all,

We have a small flat with under floor heating and a Keston Celcius 25 in a pressurised system. Having read many horror stories on these boilers via Google I still can not find a definitive solution.

The problem started when the boiler stopped igniting properly. It would try and fail 4 times then give up with an error code "Failed to light, try again then call service engineer".

When failing to light I could hear the very fast clicking/snapping noise which I assume is like a spark plug. I did manage to get it going again simply by turning it off and on again about 4 times. Now it is quite temperamental. When it fails to ignite is makes a strange gasping noise and the body flexes a bit as if air was being blown inside it in very short quick bursts.

It has been like this a couple of days but now the pressure is all disappearing - I can top it up a mains tap but it won't last the night. One of the red release valves I can hear which is directly below the gauge has a very very slight weep - I had this about a year ago but then suddenly it stopped. I presume some sediment manages to get in to the mechanism of it.
This could be where some of the pressure is going. However I heard a noise from the boiler yesterday that concerned me. Once I topped up the pressure I could hear a faint drip every 10s or so from inside the boiler - sounded and almost felt like it was hitting the bottom panel. This would be another way for the pressure to release I think but I can not see any excess water anywhere. This was not like the trickle of water you can get out of one of the plastic pipes leading out of the boiler (not sure what that is).

Any advice on what to do would be appreciated. It was installed 5 years ago. Keston (who are down the road) have given me 2 numbers of engineers, both of which do not answer. I am in Bromley, Kent.

Many thanks,
Jack

 

[Puddle]

Great ,you live a stones throw from them and can not get any one to visit,I would go round there and play up,maybe that would get someone round
I do not like Kestons as have a lot of lemons
sounds like something is sticking,maybe gas valve assembaly,the leak ,would think can be fixed,as said pay them a visit,shame them into having a look,at least if you can get someone to call ,you can get idea of repair cost,if it can be repaired, if to much would very much think about replacing

 

[Jack155Q4]

Had British Gas out today on a £99 fee to fix with parts and labour and me taking an insurance plan after.

BG said they will not take it on under the insurance plan, nor could he fix all the faults so my £99 is refunded and the insurance plan is stopped before it even begun.

The air purge valve in the boiler was faulty causing air to escape but also not closing when it should have allowing water out and the pressure to drop. He did something to it and now the pressure seems to remain but when the boiler comes up there is a lot of noise from the water pipes, sloshing and gargling etc. I suspect it may not be letting any air out now. Although it quietened down now.

Other problems were that the heating expansion vessel will not allow any air in for him to pump up the system - not sure why he didn't allow the mains water feed to do this though.

The pressure during the past 14 odd months where I have noticed is apparently 1 to 1.5bar too high (running at 3 to 3.5Bar)

There was some tiny leak marks on the exhaust pipes which is a bit worrying...very silly of us never to have had a carbon monoxide meter in the flat. Will sort that tomorrow.

He could not solve the failure to ignite of the boiler. He phoned Keston (manufacturer) and they told him to cut a wire. Not sure which one but he declined to do this as he would probably loose his job. Have read online since that this is only temporary to rule out the condensate trap.

As a result of all this we are looking to buy a new boiler. Provided this one is not leaking any carbon monoxide we can carry on as I can usually get it to light on the 4th attempt or so (it tries itself 4 times per attempt then locks out).

He recommended the best being a Worcester Bosch, then Glow-worm, Baxi or Ideal.

No idea what I am looking at really. To complicate things I need a twin flue type, not the singe 2 in 1 type.

Any help and advice on choosing a new boiler would be appreciated.

Cheers,
Jack

I intended to post the above on Monday, but just as an update since then and now:

Touch wood, it has been fine since BG engineer left on Monday. I have the setting for hot water to "Constant" so it just tops up the tank here and there. I wonder as it is going on and off more often whether the heat retained in the boiler is causing the ignition to work better. Previously it would be 22 hours between igniting.

Also the pressure is sitting much lower as I have realised I was over-topping it up.

I wonder if this could have been contributory to ignition failure? Doubt it though.

 

[Blake]

You wanna get an engineer in that can do some basic fault finding for you to determine what the problem might be. I would not start to look at throwing money at a new boiler until you know what is wrong with it and the cost to repair it. Once repaired, you may get several more years out of it.

Oh, and I've come across a few instances where BG decide that can not cover it under there fixed price repair. Also, how can BG say they can't fix all the problems when they don't seem to have figured out exactly what was wrong with it? baffling.

A new AAV should have been fitted as they are not very expensive and quick to change. All the noise is probably air not being able to escape from the AAV as he has prob screwed it closed to stop the leak.

You say he could not pump any air into the Expansion V, did he check then to see what it was reading before trying to increase the pressure?

Get another engineer out to advise you on the problems and give you an idea of cost to repair, that way you can make an informative decision on whether to fit a new one or not.

 

[Jack155Q4]

Thank you Darryl, appreciate the advice there.

I did not see him check the pressure in the expansion vessel but didn't want to be hovering over him the whole time. I will check it myself and try to pump it up if need be. What is the operational pressure for one or do they vary?

I will look at changing the AAV too.

 

[Blake]

Have you got a manual for it?

[DLMURL]http://www.keston.co.uk/downloads/manuals/Celsius-25-manual.pdf[/DLMURL]

that should contain all you need to know plus has the fault finding guide.

Good luck

Oh, exp vessel normally 0.5 but can vary between appliances. You also need to isolate the boiler and drain the water to test the vessel.

 

[Mbear]

My personal experiences with kestons have all been not so good. From a safety aspect, some installers (Glasgow area) where fitting the flues with plumb centre waste pipe. The correct flues should be cleary stamped with a specific code onto them. Boilers with the incorrect flues can be deathtraps. It sounds like your problem 'could' be the spark electrodes or even the board but without seeing it in action I wouldn't hold me to that. This is my honest opinion-get shot of it, they are terrible boilers. If you keep it I'd say you'll have many Unhappy yrs of grief together.

 

[Jack155Q4]

My personal experiences with kestons have all been not so good. From a safety aspect, some installers (Glasgow area) where fitting the flues with plumb centre waste pipe. The correct flues should be cleary stamped with a specific code onto them. Boilers with the incorrect flues can be deathtraps. It sounds like your problem 'could' be the spark electrodes or even the board but without seeing it in action I wouldn't hold me to that. This is my honest opinion-get shot of it, they are terrible boilers. If you keep it I'd say you'll have many Unhappy yrs of grief together.

Thanks Mbear....whilst we save up for a new one I am going to try and keep this one chugging along whilst throwing as little money as possible at it