Header tank

[SurreyWinter]

A couple of days back I had a plumber around to sort out a leak in my loft. Turned out to be a the top of the cold water header tank (with a pile of insulation foam) that had collapsed into the tank and as a result had caused the stopcock to be blocked into "on" position. Combined with the fact that the overflow pipe was also blocked by insulation foam had led the the tank overflowing and causing the hall ceiling below to collapse.

Anyway he's now recommending replacing the cold water header tank with a sealed unit costing around £300 + labour. Is this replacement necessary and is this a reasonable price to pay?

 

[Chrisgy]

Meaning fitting an expansion vessel? That's not necessary just buy a rigid lid for it so nothing can fall in again

 

[SurreyWinter]

Meaning fitting an expansion vessel? That's not necessary just buy a rigid lid for it so nothing can fall in again

That's one line of thinking that I'm going through - give it a good clean, a new solid lid and put fresh insulation around it.

My other line is to wonder whether I'm being offered an expansion vessel (I'm sure that's what he called it) at more than it really costs.

 

[md68]

I’ve had this a couple of times over the last month with dodgy lids falling in to the tank & jamming the ball cock on. I just advise the custy to let me fit a nice strong lid & decent insulation.

End of problem.

 

[Zammo1001]

Where did expansion vessel come into it??????

I think he means sealed unit by a water tank thats got a lid a coffin style maybe with a very small access lid to it but it has a breather pipe in it.

A fairish price maybe a bit ott get other quotes in

 

[SurreyWinter]

I’ve had this a couple of times over the last month with dodgy lids falling in to the tank & jamming the ball cock on. I just advise the custy to let me fit a nice strong lid & decent insulation.

End of problem.

Thanks

What sort of thing do you use as a lid? Obviously I could just get a decent sized piece of timber, place it on the top and then get some new lagging to wrap around the tank (I assume that's needed) but wondered if there's an obvious alternative.

 

[tamz]

My other line is to wonder whether I'm being offered an expansion vessel (I'm sure that's what he called it) at more than it really costs.

He is offering you something he needs more than you do.

Forget his advice. It is not needed. Buy a lid and a new jacket. As it is the heating header tank it does not necessarily have to be close fitting.
Look here
Water Storage Tanks & Insulation

A bit cheaper than £300 + eh
I really hate rip off merchants.

 

[Zammo1001]

Just a minute give the plumber a break here thats quoteing this job!

He may well have his price out a little here but we are not sure of the state of this job and what he charges for his rates ok.

The customer THINKS he called it an expansion vessel do you not think he said feed and expansion tank and so the plumber will be going along the right track?

 

[SurreyWinter]

Just a minute give the plumber a break here thats quoteing this job!

He may well have his price out a little here but we are not sure of the state of this job and what he charges for his rates ok.

The customer THINKS he called it an expansion vessel do you not think he said feed and expansion tank and so the plumber will be going along the right track?

Customer admits to be a little confused (sorry!) as to what it was called and as I was being told the benefits of eventually replacing the lot with a megaflow system may well have got completely confused. It was described as a sealled unit with an access hatch to put your hand in for servicing with built in insulation.

Having just had the hard sell and nodded I now feel the need to actually understand what is going on!

He is offering you something he needs more than you do.

Forget his advice. It is not needed. Buy a lid and a new jacket. As it is the heating header tank it does not necessarily have to be close fitting.

Sorry - I may not have been clear - its the tank for the cold water supply to the house - not the heating.

 

[tamz]

I'll start again then the way i understood the post

" Turned out to be a the top of the cold water header tank"
Header tank as in F&E? or could that be header tank as in cistern?
"My other line is to wonder whether I'm being offered an expansion vessel (I'm sure that's what he called it)"
Expansion vessel, or expansion tank?
"I think he means sealed unit by a water tank thats got a lid a coffin style maybe with a very small access lid to it but it has a breather pipe in it."
Even if he did why change a tank that just needs a lid unless it is galvanised (no mention of the bottom ready to fall out it) or he needs the work (and the money)
"A fairish price maybe a bit ott get other quotes in"
A 250% mark up on tank and materials ie ball cock tank connector/s and bylaw kit couple of fittings??? or even worse for an expansion vessel a 1000% mark up. Spin the work out for a day and there is another 2 or 3 hundred. All for the sake of a lid.
Well fair price for a job that should cost no more than £100.

Surreywinter
As long as the tank is not galvanised, measure your tank. There may be a label stuck to the side of it with the make and model. Pop down to any local plumbers merchants and see if they can supply one and fit it yourself.
If the tank is galvanised get a quote from a reputable plumber.

 

[Resolute]

Where abouts are you surreywinter, one of the guys on here maybe prepared to give you a quote.

 

[SurreyWinter]

bad witness!

The tank is definitely not galvanised - its a sort of gray white plastic and looks like a short bath. Has a stopcock at the top and three or four exist holes. Its also full of brown sludge (from the broken lit, fibre glass etc) so needs a very good clean.

Its also definitely the tank that supplies water to the bath/ sinks/ shower as he's advised us to only drink from the mains tap in the kitchen or garage until the new tank is fitted.
He's also fitted a new stopcock - cost on the bill £44 + VAT.

I'm almost resigned to being fleeced on an emergency call out but don't fancy having the same thing happen to me a week later so need to be sure its worth it. From what I'm reading it probably isn't.

 

[tamz]

It sounds like it is a fibreglass tank. You won't be able to buy a lid for it off the shelf.

Easiest solution is to make up a wooden frame and buy some 10mm twinwalled polycarbonate sheet from BnQ. Buy a bylaw 30 kit and put the vent on the top to let the air in.

Drain the tank by turning off your new stopcock and running the bath taps until it empties. Bail out any remaining water with a small container like an ice cream carton and clean out the rest with a big sponge. Wash it all out until clean. Repeat if you like. Will take about an hour or so. Btw don't drink water from the bathroom taps anyway even when it is cleaned.

 

[SurreyWinter]

It sounds like it is a fibreglass tank. You won't be able to buy a lid for it off the shelf.

Easiest solution is to make up a wooden frame and buy some 10mm twinwalled polycarbonate sheet from BnQ. Buy a bylaw 30 kit and put the vent on the top to let the air in.

Thanks for all the advice guys - BandQ in the morning!

Well, 24 hours later and things have moved on – hopefully for the better.

Feeling a little bit bolder after the advice and guidance of this forum I’ve done the following:
1) Pushed the first plumber for a fixed quote - £640 (including VAT) for the whole job.
2) Sought an independent quote from a local plumber - £330 – including having him pop round tonight after work (probably helps that his mate is also discussing an unrelated job with me at the moment).
3) I’ve then cleaned out the tank myself and put a temporary cover on in until we get the work done – no more than a cover to keep the flies off and stop mice drowning in it but its better than nothing.
I followed Tamz’s advice but modified it a little bit. Having turned off the stopcock and drained most of the water there was still about an inch left in the tank (the out pipes are not flush with the bottom) and that inch was full of gunk. I then used a handy little battery powered pump (about £10 from B&Q but I’m sure there are loads like elsewhere – its only a cheapie) to empty the remainder of the water. About an hour with a sponge and bleach later I’m knackered but the tank is now refilled full of fresh clean water and the tank is presentable – at least until we get it replaced. I’m even tempted to fit a new lit to it and keep the existing one...


Thanks for all your help guys

 

[tamz]

Well done for having a go. Never suggested the pump as most people would not have one. At least you now have a decent price for a replacement if you so wish.
All cisterns have some degree of brown silt in the bottom. The mains water is filtered through sand so tiny particles are held in solution. As the water sits in the tank it settles therefore the longer the tank has been in, the more silt.

Good luck.

 

[Drayton Tank]

Hi

We manufacture GRP fibreglass water tanks, and lids and can with having a large range we usually have lids and tanks to match most older tanks and if not we can make something that would be suitable.

 

[Gray0689]

Thanks for all the advice guys - BandQ in the morning!

Well, 24 hours later and things have moved on – hopefully for the better.

Feeling a little bit bolder after the advice and guidance of this forum I’ve done the following:
1) Pushed the first plumber for a fixed quote - £640 (including VAT) for the whole job.
2) Sought an independent quote from a local plumber - £330 – including having him pop round tonight after work (probably helps that his mate is also discussing an unrelated job with me at the moment).
3) I’ve then cleaned out the tank myself and put a temporary cover on in until we get the work done – no more than a cover to keep the flies off and stop mice drowning in it but its better than nothing.
I followed Tamz’s advice but modified it a little bit. Having turned off the stopcock and drained most of the water there was still about an inch left in the tank (the out pipes are not flush with the bottom) and that inch was full of gunk. I then used a handy little battery powered pump (about £10 from B&Q but I’m sure there are loads like elsewhere – its only a cheapie) to empty the remainder of the water. About an hour with a sponge and bleach later I’m knackered but the tank is now refilled full of fresh clean water and the tank is presentable – at least until we get it replaced. I’m even tempted to fit a new lit to it and keep the existing one...


Thanks for all your help guys

Best not to use bleach
Milton is better