Starting up for my self,

[foley]

Hi,

I'm unemployed just now, Lost my job through lack of work the company had,
There's not much work out there atm where i stay so i've been thinking about starting up for myself,

I've been plumbing for over 10yrs 6yr on newbuilds and 5yr on maintenance work, (Time served with my papers)

I've got all the tools a plumber would ever need, (Spent a fortune on tools)
My gas card has expired thats the only down thing, So it would be mainly domestic plumbing i would be doing, Am not silly and know there more to working for your self than just doing the plumbing work, Dealing with awkward costomers ect,

Can you make a good living by just doing domestic plumbing?
Can i get any help form the goverment to set up for my self?
One thing thats holding me back is i have no spare cash for a van
Or would i be better waiting for a job with another company?

I would like to hear your thoughts

Cheers j

 

[Chris P]

I'm still training to become a plimber Foley so i can't give any advice, although any advice given i'd be interested in for obvious reasons.

Either way it works i hope it works well for you

 

[Plumbstar Tom]

what transport are you in now?
It wont hurt to set up by your self there is loads on the net about being self employed

 

[foley]

what transport are you in now?
It wont hurt to set up by your self there is loads on the net about being self employed

I have a subaru wr1 and it worth around 14k, But thats my pride and joy
Don't think i could part with my car, May sound stupid but i worked very hard to get it and would kill me to sell it, I own it outright,

I also have a little ford ka to run around in so my subaru is just for weekend use also the mrs uses it to take the kids to school,

You may think i lack ambition by not selling my car for a van, But when you have worked hard for somthing you really want it's hard to even think about selling it,

 

[Plumbstar Tom]

I have a subaru wr1 and it worth around 14k, But thats my pride and joy
Don't think i could part with my car, May sound stupid but i worked very hard to get it and would kill me to sell it, I own it outright,

I also have a little ford ka to run around in so my subaru is just for weekend use also the mrs uses it to take the kids to school,

You may think i lack ambition by not selling my car for a van, But when you have worked hard for somthing you really want it's hard to even think about selling it,

By no means was I implying to sell it! i was just enquiring as to whether you could use your car as you begin

My pride and joy is my Gixxer 600, just try and take it from me Ha

Could you not fold the seats down in the KA and fire away to begin with?

 

[foley]

By no means was I implying to sell it! i was just enquiring as to whether you could use your car as you begin

My pride and joy is my Gixxer 600, just try and take it from me Ha

Could you not fold the seats down in the KA and fire away to begin with?

The ka is just not practical for plumbing,

Was thinking about asking my mum and dad for a loan to get a van, (no interest to pay) as they have a few bob,
How do you guys know what to charge? Have yous got an hourly rate?
Jobs that ain't worth the hassle do you add more on?
Don't want to charge too much and have people think am trying to rip them off, I'm a decent and honest guy,

 

[Blake]

Hi Foley,

Do a search on the forum and you will find lots of threads of charging etc.

Going from employed to self employed is a challenge especially at the moment as work is scarce for many of us.

You need to consider:

Accountant or do books yourself
Public liability insurance
Advertising
Office
computer
Phone

And many other costs associated with being self emp.

You will also need to attempt to set up some accounts with local merchants so you can get your stock on account rather than pay upfront if money tight.

When the work is there, you can make a decent living being a plumber. Obviously you get out what you put in. I think I read somewhere that the average plumber earns 25k a year.

I personally would look to get a cheapish van that will do the job rather than splash out on something expensive and struggle to repay it (even if it is your parents).

£1500 should get you a half decent reliable van that will last you a couple of years. if things take off, then you can upgrade.

At the moment I'm considering being an undertaker as I figure I'll never be out of work

 

[johnmcginty]

£25k a year is about right for turnover atm though it will cost you around £10k a year advertising and most of the other overheads , bear in mind your first year you will be lucky if you scrape £7k. Then maybe the tories will get in and who knows what will happen? You clearly have enough experience to start up and you obviously have assets if the poo hits the fan a few times. There is a whole other ball game to being selfers than on payroll , you will have to be marketting manager and public relations manager too not to mention making some good contacts , but I won't patronise you with that as you are obviously well experienced.

Work out how much your company will be spending on overheads say for example £10k a year.
Now take £30k
minus £10k = £20k
£30k divided by 12 months = £2500 per month turnover
£2500 per month divided by 30 jobs a month average = £83 a day or £576 a week.

So if you want £20k a year you need to make £576 a week average
£576 divided by 7 jobs a week = £83 per job (ave)

If you really want to bring it you need to be forking out around £5-600 per month advertising minimum.

This is just a rough guide and only my take , maybe someone else will give their opinion. good luck and what have you got to lose ( other than you subaru) ?

Oh and before I forget yellow pages is the dark ages, eye

 

[foley]

Cheers for the advice guys,

Is it easy to set an account up at plumb centre ect?

Where is the best place to advertise? Does no one look at the yellow pages now?

Am looking to get a 2001/2002 swb transit to get me started,

Would rather put the mrs on the game than sell the subaru lol

 

[wnjswozo]

you need to have a reserve fund,you wont make out for 3 months,by the time you sort P l/insurance,van,acc, its tough but stick with it

 

[Blackcatgas]

£25k a year is about right for turnover atm though it will cost you around £10k a year advertising and most of the other overheads , bear in mind your first year you will be lucky if you scrape £7k. Then maybe the tories will get in and who knows what will happen? You clearly have enough experience to start up and you obviously have assets if the poo hits the fan a few times. There is a whole other ball game to being selfers than on payroll , you will have to be marketting manager and public relations manager too not to mention making some good contacts , but I won't patronise you with that as you are obviously well experienced.

Work out how much your company will be spending on overheads say for example £10k a year.
Now take £30k
minus £10k = £20k
£30k divided by 12 months = £2500 per month turnover
£2500 per month divided by 30 jobs a month average = £83 a day or £576 a week.

So if you want £20k a year you need to make £576 a week average
£576 divided by 7 jobs a week = £83 per job (ave)

If you really want to bring it you need to be forking out around £5-600 per month advertising minimum.

This is just a rough guide and only my take , maybe someone else will give their opinion. good luck and what have you got to lose ( other than you subaru) ?

Oh and before I forget yellow pages is the dark ages, eye [/QUOTE


I spent £200 on advertising last year, Iam busy enough, fair play to you John if it works for you though.

 

[johnmcginty]

Yeah it is obvouisly something which varies quite a bit , I take it you have been doing this more than 2 years blackcatgas? . I mean this is what he needs to spend on ads as a startup business, maybe not after say 10 years where most of the client base could be refferals. Not to mention this guy has no gas tickets yet. I think it also makes a difference where you are based in the uk too.

 

[oldplumber]

not being sarcastic, no job ,no money no car. Sell it get a van and money in the bank. advertice in local ad mags based on post code areas at about £50 per month for 2 ads and use parish ags etc. forget the rest. Use your cash to get back your gas tickets asplumbing wont earn you enough. Once you establish yourself and have regular customers buy yourself another lump of coloured metal after all thats all they are.

 

[justlead1]

Hi. From what you mention as too your background. Subbing to the trade may be the way forward. I am assuming you can work with pace having been on site work. Why not be specific in your marketing with an add saying "Bathroom suit old to new for £250" you will as least get calls and its then up to you to convert them. Most will be a days work others with bells and whistles will cost the customer more, but your in the door. Good `luck

 

[oldplumber]

Hi. From what you mention as too your background. Subbing to the trade may be the way forward. I am assuming you can work with pace having been on site work. Why not be specific in your marketing with an add saying "Bathroom suit old to new for £250" you will as least get calls and its then up to you to convert them. Most will be a days work others with bells and whistles will cost the customer more, but your in the door. Good `luck

Im not sure about your area, but the trade here has died a death recently and all the subbies down here have just gone out and bought their own vans and hit the tools on their own to scrape a living, resulting in a lot of quotes and bathroom jobs disappearing for me cos Im not prepared to work for peanuts, hence why my advice would be to get on back to the gas work, its more steady and reliable as an income and better paid

 

[Ockyvines]

Ok, I have been doing this stuff for 33 years.
until about 2 yrs ago I could make a very good living from it. My books show £70,000 labour only on new build subbing to another company for the yr ended April 2008.That is pretty much what I have expected for the last 25 yrs. The following yr it was about £55,000 doing the same type of work and the yr just finished which was a mix of subbing new build and my own domestic work will show a pathetic income after outgoings of about £20,000.
Why would anybody bother to go to the expense of qualifying in this trade to earn such a pathetically low wage with all the hassle that goes with it?
Now that house building is picking up again I expect to be up around £45-50,000 again this yr(still not enough, I was earning that 12 yrs ago) but my ability to earn in that field is not down to qualifications(although I have several) it is plenty of experience and a good reputation within the house building industry in my locality.
When I read posts on here about expectations of earning £25-30 k a year my heart sinks.It is a trade which requires more knowledge and skill than any I can think of but a plasterer can easily earn the same sort of money but be in the pub by 3.30 every day knowing that he will have no comebacks at all. Oh, but let's not forget that it prob took him anything up to a fortnight to learn his skills!

 

[fuzzy]

The ka is just not practical for plumbing,

Was thinking about asking my mum and dad for a loan to get a van, (no interest to pay) as they have a few bob,
How do you guys know what to charge? Have yous got an hourly rate?
Jobs that ain't worth the hassle do you add more on?
Don't want to charge too much and have people think am trying to rip them off, I'm a decent and honest guy,

i used to use a motorbike when was younger, were theres a will.......

Ok, I have been doing this stuff for 33 years.
until about 2 yrs ago I could make a very good living from it. My books show £70,000 labour only on new build subbing to another company for the yr ended April 2008.That is pretty much what I have expected for the last 25 yrs. The following yr it was about £55,000 doing the same type of work and the yr just finished which was a mix of subbing new build and my own domestic work will show a pathetic income after outgoings of about £20,000.
Why would anybody bother to go to the expense of qualifying in this trade to earn such a pathetically low wage with all the hassle that goes with it?
Now that house building is picking up again I expect to be up around £45-50,000 again this yr(still not enough, I was earning that 12 yrs ago) but my ability to earn in that field is not down to qualifications(although I have several) it is plenty of experience and a good reputation within the house building industry in my locality.
When I read posts on here about expectations of earning £25-30 k a year my heart sinks.It is a trade which requires more knowledge and skill than any I can think of but a plasterer can easily earn the same sort of money but be in the pub by 3.30 every day knowing that he will have no comebacks at all. Oh, but let's not forget that it prob took him anything up to a fortnight to learn his skills!

it really anoys me when a plasterer can earn more than me, supply and demand though. people think plumbing is the pot of gold bt everyone is struggling to make the income they did 5 years ago, plasterers are few and far between, so they get paid more per day in my expereince

 

[justlead1]

Hi Foley, If you want to earn money? Go the price work route, not sitting in a loft tapping pipes like some do for an hourly rate. Even if you under price a few, it gives you the incentive to work smarter and quicker to get out of trouble. The turn it in to cash approach has worked for me. It keeps you in a positive mood and fit. Not waiting for the hours to tick away. Clients prefer to know what the job will cost before committing. Good Luck