Help purchasing new central heating system

[Barry98]

If your near the south coast contact Ray Stafford he will do you great advice and a good deal onthe
components. If you are north of Birmingham but south of Carlisle I can help but if you are in Northern Ireland then Croppie is your man .
if your west country or n east we will be able to help but there is nobody I know that covers Foula or Lundy

:mad2:. centralheatking

ray only supplies direct to the trade

 

[Centralheatking]

I think your post is really good advice for this and would go along with all you say - I must
admit it was also fun to decipher your text speak with regard to plumbing and heating.

centralheatking

100% agree system boiler and a real outfit, not vat dodging muppet. Unvented cylinder .

If you want automated control what level are u going to, will you have a BMS PC / or are u going to give each switch an stat an ip?

If going individual room control run each room back to cellar. Build a manifold using 2 ports . One two port on each zone. Returns just back into manifold by ball valve. U can use John guest or Myson manifolds but not as easy to repair in 7 years time .

U can fix a stat in each room or a programmable stat, then use its relay to activate IP switch - back to controller

Zone valves are actuated by ip relay.

Complicated for a house. But this would allow u to fully control heating from remote location.

I would simply have each zone/ room on Rf stat programmer. (Don't locate RF recivers in basement) fix them in a suitable location on each floor and hard wire back to cellar.

Don't forget weather compensator and if going unvented get a cylinder with Spare coil as I future u may have an additional heat source. Perpetual motion heat units might be feasible next year!!

 

[mcinnes01]

Hi Ermintrude,

Thanks for the great advice/ideas, I am going very automated and being in to electronics the way I am this is going to be somewhat a custom project, although I am interested in your ip idea? Could you elaborate further, I guess there are commercial products that are assigned an ip? Do you have any examples?

In terms of temperature I am using a 1-wire bus which will allow me to have many sensors all over the place, inside and out, so I will definitely be doing my own temperature compensation. The plumber made a point but I would open it up to you, he said the more valves etc you put in, the more points of failure you introduce in terms of dirt in the system clogging valves over time so they don't properly close.

Ideally I would be able to control each room, but the plumber said perhaps just control each floor, so you can have the heating come on downstairs when you get home from work and upstairs just before you go to bed. But me being me I like the idea of controlling everything.

I looked at the solenoid valves that retro fit your radiator something like watts%20industries%20-%2022c%20electrothermic%20actuators%20-%20advanced%20water%20company/.

Alternatively I was thinking of something like an in line valve like ebay.co.uk/itm/DC-24V-2-Port-2-Way-1-4-PT-Female-Thread-Pneumatic-Electric-Solenoid-Valve-/121157359590?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item1c358a97e6.

Cat5 is being run to each radiator, this can carry either 24v to control the solenoids or any other signal.

I will definitely look for twin coil cylinder, would you recommend getting an open vented one the same make as the boiler or is there a particular brand you would recommend? Also do you think 210L is enough?

Finally what are your opinions on the green deal / scrapage scheme, this may be a rude word on this forum, but I notice B****sh Gas are offering £400 scrap for your old boiler and can do the green deal offer £270 ish off boilers?

Thanks again,

Andy

 

[dancinplumba]

Anyone will give you 400 scrappage, I will give you 1000 . I will just add it to the bill

 

[dancinplumba]

Why not use a manifold system for rads ? Like you have with underfloor heating ? Makes control and wiring simpler

 

[Ermintrude]

Wash your mouth out. Boiler scrap? I will give you £9000 back but job is going to cost u £18000.

Get a better plumber.

Run flow and return to each room. Build a service riser into your house and radiate from it. Trays for 240 and segregated basket for cat 5.

All switching 240 and use Honeywell 2 port valves. Bus cable may make a lot of noise, are you familiar with control algorithms? You need at a minimum PID to avoid overshoot.

Oversize your rads by 15% at a delta T of 35c not 55 and crop end of heat up. Compensator should lift set point and keep curve fixed.

http://www.robot-electronics.co.uk/htm/eth_rly16tech.htm

210L ok. ACV will give you correct spec if you contact them. I would use the ideal logic system boiler. Small powerful and reliable.

Are you competent programmer as your controls only as good as what's managing it all.

 

[mutley racers]

Wash your mouth out. Boiler scrap? I will give you £9000 back but job is going to cost u £18000.

Get a better plumber.

Run flow and return to each room. Build a service riser into your house and radiate from it. Trays for 240 and segregated basket for cat 5.

All switching 240 and use Honeywell 2 port valves. Bus cable may make a lot of noise, are you familiar with control algorithms? You need at a minimum PID to avoid overshoot.

Oversize your rads by 15% at a delta T of 35c not 55 and crop end of heat up. Compensator should lift set point and keep curve fixed.

Ethernet RLY16

210L ok. ACV will give you correct spec if you contact them. I would use the ideal logic system boiler. Small powerful and reliable.

Are you competent programmer as your controls only as good as what's managing it all.

What the heck does all that mean?

 

[Ermintrude]

Why not use a manifold system for rads ? Like you have with underfloor heating ? Makes control and wiring simpler

Harder to use with ip as no microswitch .

 

[Ermintrude]

What the heck does all that mean?

Basically it's about control, when u heat up a room if rad size calculated using a 35c difference as the quality mfrs. cheap ones use 55 so a crap rad appears to have a higher output than it actally does.

If rad slightly oversized u can cut heating to rad before room hits desired temp, residual heat in rad tickles room upto temp and avoids overshoot (sweating ur nuts off because room stat said 21 but rads still going at 25c )

Ip switching is basically using Internet to operate a switch.

Compensator modulates flow temp dependant on external temp.

 

[mutley racers]

Thanks for clearing that up. I still have a lot to learn!!!