Power flush

[cardigan]

What's a 'power flush after a new CH boileris installed?' What's involved, how long does it take and what does it do?

TIA

 

[Blake]

How to Power Flush Central Heating Systems Blocked by Sludge or Rust

 

[bspareltd]

this is to prevent debris damaging boiler components, but it is usually done before the installation and it is good practice to fit a central heating filter to prevent further damage

 

[cardigan]

How to Power Flush Central Heating Systems Blocked by Sludge or Rust

Dear God, how the hell can they charge that much for a couple of hours work flushing a system?

 

[gasmanrob]

didnt see how much they charge what was it?

 

[villa_tom]

Dear God, how the hell can they charge that much for a couple of hours work flushing a system?

Its not just a couple of hours though. I've been on flushes that have taken all day. Then you've got the cost of the machine itself to pay for, then the cost of chemicals and specialist tools you may need, plus you need to cover your costs should any unforeseen problems arise from doing the actual flush.

 

[Rickster123]

Its not just a couple of hours though. I've been on flushes that have taken all day. Then you've got the cost of the machine itself to pay for, then the cost of chemicals and specialist tools you may need, plus you need to cover your costs should any unforeseen problems arise from doing the actual flush.

Straight out of the British gas handbook... :30:

 

[mfgs]

Dear God, how the hell can they charge that much for a couple of hours work flushing a system?

It is by no means a couple hours work.

 

[Leo21]

Plus we do have a lifestyle to pay for.

 

[AWheating]

the machine and equipment costs £1200 to £2000 and it takes between 4 to 8 hours to do on average. You have to pay for your van, your PLI, your fuel, your other business running costs etc......

as the saying goes you get what you pay for.


best to steer clear of large companies and use a local engineer, get some quotes.

 

[cardigan]

as the saying goes you get what you pay for.

That's all we want - a decent job for fair price; is that too much to ask for?

 

[gasmanrob]

im not particullarly cheap im about £200 more then most people in my area but im there all day fit a new pump and mag clean, use good chemicals and nutralise the system after if ive had to use a heavy chemical. oh and i remove the f&e tank wash it out and loop the f&e pipes in with a isolator so they all get cleaned too.

there are still many who disagree with power flushing and im sure some will be along in a bit. but i do it and see how much comes out and there is no way on most of the ones i do a normal chemical clean would touch them.

 

[tamz]

Straight out of the British gas handbook... :30:

But it is true

 

[petercj]

You can hire a professional powerflush machine for fifty pounds from HSS Hire (February offer), anyone of average intelligence who can read can do it - you need to be fit enough to climb up into the loft, and not prone to dying of boredom.

First time round with 12 radiators will probably take around 8 to 10 hours.

 

[Rickster123]

But it is true

Im only messing. Power flushing done correctly is a long and extremely boring task but well worth the expense in my opinion. If its rushed and not flushed thoroughly it's a pointless exercise.

 

[AWheating]

That's all we want - a decent job for fair price; is that too much to ask for?

what do you think a decent price is?

the average price is what £300-£500at a guess dependant on area and work involved.
for a good days labour from a skilled tradesman with all the costs involved probably making a wage of £150 for the days work.

seems a good price to me, my car garage charges £95 per hour labour, that over 8 hours is £760 for labour then parts ontop.

what quoted prices have you had? maybe somebody on the forum lives near you and can give you a price?

 

[petercj]

That's all we want - a decent job for fair price; is that too much to ask for?

Outside of London you will be able to get it done for around 300 pounds.

British Gas charge as much as 800 pounds, and say they guarantee it - which actually means they will then include the water in the system under a Home Care Service contract - which is around 20 pounds per month. End the contract, and the so called guarantee ends too.

 

[Toxic Ted]

Dear God, how the hell can they charge that much for a couple of hours work flushing a system?

If its that lucrative why arent you doing it youself ? If you run your own business like many people here then you will know that you dont trouser everything you charge and have overheads to pay for.

 

[helpsy]

I bought a Kamco power flush machine 2 weeks ago and got it brand new for £1080 and the Kamco guy told me I got a really good deal as they charge £1020 + VAT and then I will be buying more equipment as I go like the magnetic filter and pump head adaptor. As you can see there is a big outlay!

 

[tamz]

As you can see there is a big outlay!

For the most brain dead, despised but unfortunately mostly necessary job in the trade.

 

[kay-jay]

I agree tom. Mind numbing job but its money for old rope once you've got the gear.

 

[Barry98]

its the first thing that gets connected once drained down return flow linked while one cracks on with the install of boiler

 

[Stuthewarrior]

Did I miss the price how much were they charging ?

 

[TBServices]

its the first thing that gets connected once drained down return flow linked while one cracks on with the install of boiler

You do it cold then lee? How do you find time to run round all rads while fitting boiler?

 

[Barry98]

Lackie does that

 

[petercj]

The truth is that everything to do with powerflushing is overpriced, starting with the machines used, which basically comprise a pump connected to a plastic tub, with some valves, and a few pipes. 1k+ is a ridiculous price for something so simple.

The 800 pounds charged by BG is also a ridiculous price, but in the free market it seems there is no such thing as overcharging - 300 quid for the powerflush, and 500 quid for the BGBS!

The return on initial investment, even at 300 pounds a throw, is very good on a piece of kit costing between 1k and 1500 pounds.

Powerflushing is a first year apprentice job: requires the ability to use a wrench, a few grams of common sense, and the ability not to fall asleep on the job. Recognising the risks with a weak system is probably the most skilled bit involved.

Anyone looking for a low-cost start can set themselves up in business with a small van, an overpriced powerflush machine (with a one day training course), and enough business acumen to get the show on the road.

 

[Leo21]

The truth is that everything to do with powerflushing is overpriced, starting with the machines used, which basically comprise a pump connected to a plastic tub, with some valves, and a few pipes. 1k+ is a ridiculous price for something so simple.

The 800 pounds charged by BG is also a ridiculous price, but in the free market it seems there is no such thing as overcharging - 300 quid for the powerflush, and 500 quid for the BGBS!

The return on initial investment, even at 300 pounds a throw, is very good on a piece of kit costing between 1k and 1500 pounds.

Powerflushing is a first year apprentice job: requires the ability to use a wrench, a few grams of common sense, and the ability not to fall asleep on the job. Recognising the risks with a weak system is probably the most skilled bit involved.

Anyone looking for a low-cost start can set themselves up in business with a small van, an overpriced powerflush machine (with a one day training course), and enough business acumen to get the show on the road.

Thats really helpfull on the open forum.

 

[GasmanxxxR1]

Thats really helpfull on the open forum.

Agreed

 

[petercj]

Thats really helpfull on the open forum.

Can't see why it should be a problem to anyone pricing up jobs competitively - not so good for BG maybe, but then there's plenty worse about BG on this site.

Anyone shopping around will find that what I have said is more than reasonable - I think there are quite a few people on here out of touch with the going rates for such work, which might help to explain why they are sat on the net instead of working.

 

[Leo21]

I'm very busy thanks. Encouraging people to start up in power flushing! Personally I think it's more skilled than you make out. Different size rad valves, different types of boilers. Some of which can be damaged if not prepared correctly, running boilers dry, getting rid of air locks, etc, etc.

 

[AWheating]

the customer makes the choice, you get what you pay for.

 

[petercj]

I'm very busy thanks. Encouraging people to start up in power flushing! Personally I think it's more skilled than you make out. Different size rad valves, different types of boilers. Some of which can be damaged if not prepared correctly, running boilers dry, getting rid of air locks, etc, etc.

Have you read the rest of the thread, the majority of the posts are in a similar vein - "lackie does it' ... "money for old rope" ... etc. Strange that you think I'm giving secrets away!

I do think it's a good investment for anyone starting out, such as people with level 2 NVQ and the like, who often post on the board - what's wrong with that?

Doubt that I've triggered a wave of start-up new businesses in the UK that are going to drain work away from the plumbing trade.

 

[Toxic Ted]

Gerald Ratner springs to mind.

 

[AWheating]

who dat?

 

[Destroyer2813]

Have you read the rest of the thread, the majority of the posts are in a similar vein - "lackie does it' ... "money for old rope" ... etc. Strange that you think I'm giving secrets away!

I do think it's a good investment for anyone starting out, such as people with level 2 NVQ and the like, who often post on the board - what's wrong with that?

Doubt that I've triggered a wave of start-up new businesses in the UK that are going to drain work away from the plumbing trade.[/QUOTE

So how are these new people supposed to know what causes the symptoms for needing a flush in the firstt place?

 

[Toxic Ted]

Google him

 

[AWheating]

Google him

i only google after the third date.

 

[petercj]

Gerald Ratner springs to mind.

When Ratner was asked in a live interview about how he was able to sell jewelry so cheaply, he said: "because it's rubbish!"

I don't see anyone on this thread denigrating the value of powerflushing, i.e. questioning that it's not the best way to clean out sludge from a CH system. The issue is what is a reasonable charge. Other than BG staff, I don't think many plumbers would argue that 800 quid is a reasonable charge.

It's not the same thing as: "Doing a Ratner" - which is used now to describe rubbishing your own product.

 

[petercj]

Have you read the rest of the thread, the majority of the posts are in a similar vein - "lackie does it' ... "money for old rope" ... etc. Strange that you think I'm giving secrets away!

I do think it's a good investment for anyone starting out, such as people with level 2 NVQ and the like, who often post on the board - what's wrong with that?

Doubt that I've triggered a wave of start-up new businesses in the UK that are going to drain work away from the plumbing trade.[/QUOTE

So how are these new people supposed to know what causes the symptoms for needing a flush in the firstt place?

Probably by placing their hand on the lower part of the radiators to feel for cold spots, like most people do.

Or they could impress the customer by using one of those flashy IR thermometers like the bloke on You Tube.

 

[AWheating]

you can also do the trouser snake tests as i offten hear engineers say around by me. never tired it myself.

 

[petercj]

you can also do the trouser snake tests as i offten hear engineers say around by me. never tired it myself.

Feeling around in other people's trouser pockets has never appealed to me! :-@

 

[AWheating]

some of the older blokes i worked with as an apprentice would say a radiator is working correctly if you put your trouser snake on the top and it hurts, if you can hold it there then its not warm enough. I wonder if the method was ever tried? ouch!

 

[Leo21]

Explaining why youve got your tool on a radiator ight take some explaining.

 

[petercj]

some of the older blokes i worked with as an apprentice would say a radiator is working correctly if you put your trouser snake on the top and it hurts, if you can hold it there then its not warm enough. I wonder if the method was ever tried? ouch!

In order to determine whether the problem was trapped air or sludge, they would have to start at the top and work their way down - reckon they would need to be short and very well endowed, or have extremely flexible knees.

The Michael Jackson crotch thrust comes to mind, and those little shrieks he used to let out!

The auditions for Green Deal assessors would make good Saturday night TV I reckon!

 

[AWheating]

i think ill stick with my infra red gun, its cold this winter :hand:

 

[villa_tom]

Whats your problem? You seem hell bent on rubbing people up the wrong way on here. The price is the price, if you like it good for you if you don't then get another quote.

 

[AWheating]

Integrity what is that?

back again to slag off plumbers i see. nice to see you again.

please join a maths forum and moan about your life there.

 

[SimonG]

Mr 'I've come for advice from the people who are ripping me off' is back again

 

[TBServices]

Ban hammer!

 

[Roger Welton]

If you want to do it yourself, no ones stopping you, I personally wouldn't want to be pumping high temperature acid around my house without knowing what I was doing and the potential problems that could encountered, but each to there own.