Discuss Mixing Pressure Problems in the Central Heating Forum area at PlumbersForums.net
Glad that you've enjoyed the Craic... You may be right, but I'm never going to get that sorted before Christmas! I feel like I'm getting somewhere but as I said to John earlier, everything in this system is nonstandard and I'm just a man with no knowledge of plumbing trying to figure it all. Let's just say that if I was putting this in from scratch I probably would have chosen something a little more "standard". I'll invite everyone to come and have a look once things get back to normal!!!!I've watched this thread with interest im still sure only real cure is in essence to convert manifolds to standard pump/blender layout its done that way because it works!.
If its what you want flow temperatures double what our achieving would be possible
You have too many UFH circuits to feed to have any chance of an unconventional system to work well - unless you know exactly what you are doing. The UFH circuits take a high percentage of the boiler output - they need to be fed directly from the boiler - with the radiator and Dhw circuit in parallel.
The concept of using pumps for “injection” on low temperature heating systems is common in the world of thermal stores, but you need temperature sensors properly located and a control system to drive the pump. From what I can see on your photos, the pump you refer to as an injector is not plumbed in correctly and does not appear to have a temperature control loop or a limiting device to set or limit the flow temperature into the UFH loops. You don’t want 60 plus degree boiler flow temperatures entering the UFH loops.
On a system such as yours, the feed for the UFH circulation should come direct from the boiler to a pumped manifold with a mixing valve - relatively cheap and it will work.
If you had one or two UFH loops you may get it to work in an uncontrolled manner by tweeking it.
[automerge]1606946732[/automerge]The system does have thermocouples and a control system. There is a temperature sensor for the boiler feed, and a temperature sensor for the mix. The injection pump is supposedly controlled by the processing unit to control the flow of water into the UFH system so that the temperature of the mix is appropriate to the outdoor conditions (which is measured by a third thermocouple on the north facing wall). It's just that the pressure on the UFH is hard to balance and I don't know enough about a Grundfos Alpha 2L to know what I'm doing!
The bluebox on the wall is a kanmor 361e controller.The system does have thermocouples and a control system. There is a temperature sensor for the boiler feed, and a temperature sensor for the mix. The injection pump is supposedly controlled by the processing unit to control the flow of water into the UFH system so that the temperature of the mix is appropriate to the outdoor conditions (which is measured by a third thermocouple on the north facing wall). It's just that the pressure on the UFH is hard to balance and I don't know enough about a Grundfos Alpha 2L to know what I'm doing!
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I don't know enough about this stuff but I'm learning. Here's the schematic of my system from the book. (Although I've no radiators). As I said I'm just a science teacher trying to warm up his house.I will say no more. Look at the schematic on page 1 of the manual on the link you have posted.
That is not the system you have shown in your photos. Also note the inputs ( 3 no to the controller) and then reread my earlier posting
Pipe to the left is hot, injector pipe is hot, pipe to the right is hot but cools once it gets to the relay. Pump is hot and temp is rising again.can you just feel the pipe just to the left of the T for the injection pump, it should be very hot....at boiler temperature, now feel the pipe on the inlet to the inj pump...that too should be at the same temperature, if not and only lukewarm (30C) then you are simply pulling in cold water from the by pass and the system will never work, you have a good chance if you break the flow/return loop.
Pipe to the left is hot, injector pipe is hot, pipe to the right is hot but cools once it gets to the relay. Pump is hot and temp is rising again. I've got pump set to lowest setting which seems to help.can you just feel the pipe just to the left of the T for the injection pump, it should be very hot....at boiler temperature, now feel the pipe on the inlet to the inj pump...that too should be at the same temperature, if not and only lukewarm (30C) then you are simply pulling in cold water from the by pass and the system will never work, you have a good chance if you break the flow/return loop.
Even the pipe directly under the pump feels hot..... Oooohhhh such excitementI don't know enough about this stuff but I'm learning. Here's the schematic of my system from the book. (Although I've no radiators). As I said I'm just a science teacher trying to warm up his house.
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Pipe to the left is hot, injector pipe is hot, pipe to the right is hot but cools once it gets to the relay. Pump is hot and temp is rising again.
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Pipe to the left is hot, injector pipe is hot, pipe to the right is hot but cools once it gets to the relay. Pump is hot and temp is rising again. I've got pump set to lowest setting which seems to help.
Cycling. It seems to kick in to push the temp up then falls back. I think it's kicking in when the boiler temp sensor falls below about 52. It pushes it up to about 72 and switches off.Didn't realize you had no rads so if no demand for HW then is the boiler running constantly now or cycling on/off?.
Now it seems to be constant..... I need to spend less time with my boiler and more with my wife!Cycling. It seems to kick in to push the temp up then falls back. I think it's kicking in when the boiler temp sensor falls below about 52. It pushes it up to about 72 and switches off.
Looks good, the only downside to that would be that (from what I've read) the system would be less efficient as the control system wouldn't be able to regulate temp. But at this point in time I'd take an inefficient system that works over an efficient cold one that doesn't.... I'll keep you up to date with temps as they fluctuate, and have a drop for me!OK, thanks.
Picasso has had a good drop of Jamesons tonight so sketching not up to his usual standard but this is the way I would go if you don't want to modify to a 3 way thermostatic mixer, there isn't much involved, as I said previously, you can leave the existing by pass if you wish (less work) View attachment 46533and just do the other changes.
It seems to be working of sorts. I think that the system is possibly too big and the flow of water too low to heat the house properly. I can get the rooms up to 21/22 but the circulating hot water never gets above 35. I suppose that this makes it more efficient, but it can't cope with sudden changes in temp! I managed to get the pressure balanced by a bit of trial and error, but I'm seriously thinking of buying myself a thermal imaging device so that I can see what's really going on!Any update on the above?.
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