6189 needed whats best way!?!?

[e8plumber]

Hello there this may be a very talked about subject but I'm in need of help!

I Was wondering if any experienced plumbers or some one who has completed it could help me. I got my 6129 (i know now its nothing without NVQ) a 3/4 years ago and have been working since. I am with my 3rd employer now as my others didn't cover what you need to gain the 6189 (NVQ) qualification. they were a gas engineer and a solar heating firm.

I have enrolled at my local college where i got my 6129 from. But they are making it very long winded to pass this or even get started as I enrolled in september and have only just got a portfolio! I also need to do maths, english and a ict exam before they can give me the 6189 which can not happen till next year! I also have to complete a lot of tasks that my site may not cover as in 2 different bathroom 1 being old! (I'm on a new build). I then rang a few training centres like 'able skills' and 'olci' they gave me a big price £1,650/£1,700 but say that they just need to do 4 on site visits and then once seen confidence on site and completed tasks given then they pass you off... This sounded too good except the price. I mean how quick can they come out and see me and how long does it all take? My boss will give me a pay rise and ill become a plumber improver as soon as I have my NVQ and then I can look to level 3/gas.

Any one on here who has either completed this with a college or training centre that can give advice, it will be much appreciated. I want to know if paying that money will be a much quick and better process in long run! Supposedly the training centre said I have till before christmas to register for the 6189 because after that my 6129 is going to be useless as they have changed it to some thing else. I would then have to resist the replacement which is everything i have already done just with 2 extra criterias!!!! Why can this all not be simpler!!!!

Any help much appreciated as time running out and I just want my NVQ now as it should have happened ages ago!

 

[Dannyparty92]

Don't worry about it just learn the trade more important than a piece of paper. Iv only got the 6129 and there are other plumbers on here who have the 6129 and that alone.

 

[e8plumber]

Don't worry about it just learn the trade more important than a piece of paper. Iv only got the 6129 and there are other plumbers on here who have the 6129 and that alone.

But what about if you change employer and although your current boss knows you know the trade. The next boss wants to see your cards?

 

[Dannyparty92]

Urmm don't change employer. Ha

 

[e8plumber]

Urmm don't change employer. Ha

My boss said once I get NVQ tho he will move me to a plumbers improver which has a better wage then apprentice and then once got level 3.gas then get the plumbers wage! Also the boss is not my direct employer I got put to work with his company through a government apprenticesship and I have done well and he said he would take me on directly.

 

[e8plumber]

But yeah I just want the reliability of having my cards. Was hoping there may be some one who was in a similar situation or used a good training centre to get there NVQ

 

[Deleted member 25704]

But yeah I just want the reliability of having my cards. Was hoping there may be some one who was in a similar situation or used a good training centre to get there NVQ

Plumbing qualifications are of dubious quality, along with many other vocational qualifications. There have been several reviews recently - the Wolf Review, the Holt Review of apprenticeships and very recently Richard Review (2012). They all say the same thing in that there is little currency or value in NVQs.

The summary of the review is here:
http://feweek.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/RICHARD_REVIEW_SUMMARY.pdf

The full review is here:
http://www.schoolforstartups.co.uk/richard-review/richard-review-full.pdf

The good bit of the Richard review is that the current apprenticeship framework has been thrown out in terms of his recommendations with regard to competency systems and portfolios - so changes are afoot.

If you have been working already, then you don't have to do a course to get an NVQ - you should seek advice on Accreditation of Prior Learning (APL).

Any employer worth working for will judge you on what you can do, not what papers you have. So save your money and start to take a professional interest in your trade - perhaps join a professional body and do some continued professional development for free - membership of a professional body such as CIPHE is possible without an NVQ - they will send out a professional standards inspector to judge your work - this equivalent of doing NVQ.

 

[e8plumber]

Plumbing qualifications are of dubious quality, along with many other vocational qualifications. There have been several reviews recently - the Wolf Review, the Holt Review of apprenticeships and very recently Richard Review (2012). They all say the same thing in that there is little currency or value in NVQs.

The summary of the review is here:
http://feweek.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/RICHARD_REVIEW_SUMMARY.pdf

The full review is here:
http://www.schoolforstartups.co.uk/richard-review/richard-review-full.pdf

The good bit of the Richard review is that the current apprenticeship framework has been thrown out in terms of his recommendations with regard to competency systems and portfolios - so changes are afoot.

If you have been working already, then you don't have to do a course to get an NVQ - you should seek advice on Accreditation of Prior Learning (APL).

Any employer worth working for will judge you on what you can do, not what papers you have. So save your money and start to take a professional interest in your trade - perhaps join a professional body and do some continued professional development for free - membership of a professional body such as CIPHE is possible without an NVQ - they will send out a professional standards inspector to judge your work - this equivalent of doing NVQ.

APL ill have to look in to that, You say they can help me without doing the tests to get a NVQ as long as I have prior work experience and reference. I used to be a member of CIPHE when I was looking for work doing my 6129. I never knew they could also send out a inspector to see work. What is it that they can give you that is of the equivalent of a NVQ? Thank you for your information its much appreciated.

 

[Deleted member 25704]

"You say they can help me without doing the tests to get a NVQ as long as I have prior work experience and reference".

Read more: http://www.ukplumbersforums.co.uk/plumbing-forum/43977-6189-needed-whats-best-way.html#ixzz2DeBOXzqO

No, you don't get the NVQ but you might have the skills and knowledge to get the equivalent professional status - which might satisfy your employer. There are different routes to CIPHE membership, so get in touch with them and find out the details given your circumstances. They will look at your experience and qualifications and suggest a membership category. Say they offer full membership, then this means you are operating at NVQ3 or above, but you will still need to satisfy whatever criteria they want. But its worth enquiring if you are frustrated with NVQs. This route would be ok for domestic plumbing.

Membership of such a body will create a rationale to discuss with your employer - you could say you are not convinced that the NVQ will be value for money and suggest a different route which you employer may be satisfied with.

On the other hand, the current system is easy so doing NVQ now will be more simple than in the very near future, when valid and reliable quaifications are developed for the sector. The NVQ route is also better if you are in industrial plumbing and on JIB pay rates which are related to NVQs.

Accreditation of Prior Learning is what NVQs were originally designed for, before they were hijacked by 'industry', but colleges would rather sell you a load of stuff instead of taking time to see what you can do. If you are working competently then someone should be able to observe this and accredit you with the qualifation without having to do a college course - they did this en mass with train to gain, so it should still be possible. I would question the requirement to do maths and english if you are a mature student.

Perhaps contact the National Apprenticeship Service NAS to see if they can give you more information on APL - News & Media - Apprenticeships

 

[e8plumber]

"You say they can help me without doing the tests to get a NVQ as long as I have prior work experience and reference".

Read more: http://www.ukplumbersforums.co.uk/plumbing-forum/43977-6189-needed-whats-best-way.html#ixzz2DeBOXzqO

No, you don't get the NVQ but you might have the skills and knowledge to get the equivalent professional status - which might satisfy your employer. There are different routes to CIPHE membership, so get in touch with them and find out the details given your circumstances. They will look at your experience and qualifications and suggest a membership category. Say they offer full membership, then this means you are operating at NVQ3 or above, but you will still need to satisfy whatever criteria they want. But its worth enquiring if you are frustrated with NVQs. This route would be ok for domestic plumbing.

Membership of such a body will create a rationale to discuss with your employer - you could say you are not convinced that the NVQ will be value for money and suggest a different route which you employer may be satisfied with.

On the other hand, the current system is easy so doing NVQ now will be more simple than in the very near future, when valid and reliable quaifications are developed for the sector. The NVQ route is also better if you are in industrial plumbing and on JIB pay rates which are related to NVQs.

Accreditation of Prior Learning is what NVQs were originally designed for, before they were hijacked by 'industry', but colleges would rather sell you a load of stuff instead of taking time to see what you can do. If you are working competently then someone should be able to observe this and accredit you with the qualifation without having to do a college course - they did this en mass with train to gain, so it should still be possible. I would question the requirement to do maths and english if you are a mature student.

Perhaps contact the National Apprenticeship Service NAS to see if they can give you more information on APL - News & Media - Apprenticeships

seriously can't thank you enough for your detailed replies, The Firm I am with do commercial and domestic work but look for your JIB cards so Guess a NVQ will make a difference. I am going to talk to CIPHE explain what I have and how long I have been working and see what membership that they would offer me. My college said I have to do maths and english as my GCSE are over 5 years old :S I protested but they said its a must! I have agreed to take them as well as this oct test too. Im thinking ill stray away from these training centres then that you have to pay for as it sounds they are a waste of money? Again thank you. I have been pulling my hair out for ages trying to get help on getting further with plumbing.

 

[e8plumber]

"You say they can help me without doing the tests to get a NVQ as long as I have prior work experience and reference".

Read more: http://www.ukplumbersforums.co.uk/plumbing-forum/43977-6189-needed-whats-best-way.html#ixzz2DeBOXzqO

No, you don't get the NVQ but you might have the skills and knowledge to get the equivalent professional status - which might satisfy your employer. There are different routes to CIPHE membership, so get in touch with them and find out the details given your circumstances. They will look at your experience and qualifications and suggest a membership category. Say they offer full membership, then this means you are operating at NVQ3 or above, but you will still need to satisfy whatever criteria they want. But its worth enquiring if you are frustrated with NVQs. This route would be ok for domestic plumbing.

Membership of such a body will create a rationale to discuss with your employer - you could say you are not convinced that the NVQ will be value for money and suggest a different route which you employer may be satisfied with.

On the other hand, the current system is easy so doing NVQ now will be more simple than in the very near future, when valid and reliable quaifications are developed for the sector. The NVQ route is also better if you are in industrial plumbing and on JIB pay rates which are related to NVQs.

Accreditation of Prior Learning is what NVQs were originally designed for, before they were hijacked by 'industry', but colleges would rather sell you a load of stuff instead of taking time to see what you can do. If you are working competently then someone should be able to observe this and accredit you with the qualifation without having to do a college course - they did this en mass with train to gain, so it should still be possible. I would question the requirement to do maths and english if you are a mature student.

Perhaps contact the National Apprenticeship Service NAS to see if they can give you more information on APL - News & Media - Apprenticeships

seriously can't thank you enough for your detailed replies, The Firm I am with do commercial and domestic work but look for your JIB cards so Guess a NVQ will make a difference. I am going to talk to CIPHE explain what I have and how long I have been working and see what membership that they would offer me. My college said I have to do maths and english as my GCSE are over 5 years old :S I protested but they said its a must! I have agreed to take them as well as this ict test too. Im thinking ill stray away from these training centres then that you have to pay for as it sounds they are a waste of money? Again thank you. I have been pulling my hair out for ages trying to get help on getting further with plumbing.