Garden pipe using 25mm MDPE pipe

[fingersuk]

I'm going to put a garden tap on the rear of the property as I only have on the front of the property. I've decided to do this myself. It's roughly a 12-14 metre run it will need to be run from the loft.

In the loft I have a cold shower feed that's a 15mm copper pipe. I want to connect to this a 25mm blue mdpe, ideally with a self tap as I dont want cut and join it as i've not got much experience in that. I will need some sort of isolation valve here and non return to cover water regs. I've had a look but dont know the best option to give me the isolation valve, non-return and then self tap into the existing copper pipe feeding the 25mm mdpe.

The other issue is I need to drill in the loft via the fascia board, as it's roughly 90 degress, I'll need to cut the mdpe pipe and use the joiner. Will a 28mm hole be enough for the mdpe 90 degree bend as they seem quite bulky from the photos, I was then going to back fill anything left with expanding foam.... I fully understand I'll need to lag the outside part of the pipe unfortunately, there is no other route for it to run.

I've found the fittings for the 25mm mdpe wall plate, but will be installing a t junction here but putting a end slot in it as at some stage I want to dig the garden side up and run another water pipe out to the allotment.

I can't really call a plumber as they are not interested in the small jobs or quote a silly amount of money for it.

 

[Plum Bob 66]

I find it hard to believe a local plumber would not take on the job, it's not that smaller job in reality. You sound competent enough with the theory but if your unsure of the practical I would call in a professional in order to save you a future headache.

 

[PlumbBobBob]

i wouldn't use a self cutter for this, the flow will be non existent over that distance imho

 

[Kyle87]

Is it a mixer shower or just the feed to an electric.

The guys here will correct me if in wrong but there could be a scald risk if its a shower mixer.

If you turn outside tap on you could reduce the amount of cold water going to the shower and the user would get a sudden blast of hot.

I could be wrong and may have misread so apologies if that's the case

Kyle

 

[plumber86]

hi I thought MDPE was for below ground use age only at the sunlight can damage the pipe wouldn't using hep20 or speedfit be easier please correct me if im wrong ?

 

[plumber86]

hi sorry just check it out and found this mdpe plastic pipe is intended mainly for underground use. If used above ground it can be damaged by exposure to light, and must be covered/insulated etc.

 

[Megaflo-Experts]

I can't really call a plumber as they are not interested in the small jobs or quote a silly amount of money for it.

How many plumbers did you try, and how "silly" were the prices quoted?

 

[supper plumb]

where in the uk are you one of the guys here will be able to help you out

 

[lame plumber]

must be a better place to connect in than your attic!!

 

[supper plumb]

plain and simple you want to run a main front the front to the back???can you not dig the drive/side walk up and Tee off mains with MDPE pipe?
rather then have a nice big lagged pipe down the side of the building and running of a shower??

 

[fingersuk]

It's cold feed in shower.


MDPE will need to be lagged anyway as outside from loft it will need to come down by the outside drainpipe. As i'm going to then feed it off at some stage to the allotment, it is more economical to use blue mdpe pipe and by 50metres. The later part of the feed wont be done until next year id say.


I'm in Hereford, we've had quotes upto £300. The parts alone are around £40-50 and its a two hour job in reality. Most plumbers in this area only want new boiler installs and not the small jobs, so have been putting prices up. I've only got quotes from two though mind you.


It's a mid terranced house kitchen at front, cold shower feed from attic is only option as the wife does not want to run it from attic shower feed -> airing cupboard -> takeup landing boards and feed to babys room -> then drill outside and bring down 3 metres to final point.

 

[Ray Stafford]

and its a two hour job in reality.

I've seen a fair few "2 hour jobs" over the years. Some of them could be done in a day. Many ran into the second day.

 

[SimonG]

Crack on lad. You'll turn that 2 hour job into a full shift job. Self cutter onto 25mm mdpe, luckily I missed my laptop with my tea.

If you have used the same sort of tone with the two plumbers as you have on here, then I can understand why you have had quotes around the 300 mark. I tend to overprice a job that I 'foresee' difficulties with.

 

[PlumbBobBob]

the only real option i can see is to connect in the kitchen and bring the mdpe under the floor to the back, then through the back wall.

 

[lame plumber]

gonna take more than 2 hours to dig the trench!

 

[stevetheplumber]

as soon as some one tells me its only a small job i loose interest as it usually means they dont want to pay much

 

[fingersuk]

Not sure how I managed to upset people by saying what I'm thinking, to put this in context never ever had trouble with workman before plumbers are hard to get and expensive round here.

For me this job seems so simple, no need to run it through floors etc with new born. From loft and down outside wall seems to do job be it not the best option and needs lagging. This is also the simplest one hole and then length of pipe be it I suggested using mope as I want to use it later and it will be covered so no issues I can foresee.

My issue is I'm not a plumber but really the question has been answered a self cut won't cut it, so it will need to be isolated then drained then cut and rejoined. Again I'm not sure what parts would be best to connect this to 25mm mdpe tube from standard copper fitting. Also I need a 90 degree bend coming out of house and need to know what size hole it would be with fittings.

There's always more than one solution to skin a cat, be it not what plumbers would usually do, however, as long as joints are water tight and pipe is lagged it shouldn't be an issue.

I dont have loads of money otherwise I'd get a plumber todo this for me. Hence why I'm asking for help and do appreciate the responses.

 

[b.lynch plum]

Alright mate you have said it yourself it might not be the right way to do the job but you see it as saving you money, fair play. But you heard the saying if your going to do a job do it right!? How much you going to save when you try and do it and somthink goes wrong and hay you end up calling some one in?? Why don't you just wait and save to get some1 in to do it the right way first time that will be the best way to go mate. Saves getting water in ya atic and all down the ceilings

 

[Kyle87]

Change a torbeck valve:

Less than 5 mins once infront if wc with tools and isolation valve present.

My gas man called me( he has a very bad back)

He was changing one for his neighbour but was struggling to get access.

Turned out that the cistern sat so the torbeck nut was hidden and wing nuts were rusted.

Turned into a job for the angle grinder. Disconnect bog. Flip it. Cut close couple kit. Change valve. Drive to dumbfix for a new close couple kit as didn't have one on van.

Reconnect pan. Job done.
Can't remember how long it took altogether but it wa daft.

I've been in and out in 20 mins changing one. That includes getting tools/wet vac in and out and collecting 50 quid when ya pass go etc

 

[fingersuk]

Alright mate you have said it yourself it might not be the right way to do the job but you see it as saving you money, fair play. But you heard the saying if your going to do a job do it right!? How much you going to save when you try and do it and somthink goes wrong and hay you end up calling some one in?? Why don't you just wait and save to get some1 in to do it the right way first time that will be the best way to go mate. Saves getting water in ya atic and all down the ceilings

Ok let's try rewording it then rather than say use mdpe pipe. What pipe should I be using and what fittings do I need for copper pipe that I need to go from.

Still can't understand why someone won't give me simple answers rather than saying get someone in etc. if I wanted water leaking in my loft I'd make sure it wasn't a water tight fit. Easy enough to check and test on trial peace out of loft, if I can't get it right out of the loft I'm in trouble simple.

Still can't see why mdpe pipe can't be used though as long is its all water tight and done correctly!

 

[dancinplumba]

Times are hard, friends are few, what do you do for a living

 

[Plum Bob 66]

Change a torbeck valve:

Less than 5 mins once infront if wc with tools and isolation valve present.

My gas man called me( he has a very bad back)

He was changing one for his neighbour but was struggling to get access.

Turned out that the cistern sat so the torbeck nut was hidden and wing nuts were rusted.

Turned into a job for the angle grinder. Disconnect bog. Flip it. Cut close couple kit. Change valve. Drive to dumbfix for a new close couple kit as didn't have one on van.

Reconnect pan. Job done.
Can't remember how long it took altogether but it wa daft.

I've been in and out in 20 mins changing one. That includes getting tools/wet vac in and out and collecting 50 quid when ya pass go etc

There is a lesson to be learnt here, oh yes found it. Jobs that you think are small can more often than not bite you in the arse....... Is my understanding right Kyle?

 

[PlumbBobBob]

There is a lesson to be learnt here, oh yes found it. Jobs that you think are small can more often than not bite you in the arse....... Is my understanding right Kyle?

i would say your assumption is spot on

 

[Reg Man]

Dogs Dinner?

 

[Phil_Plumb]

Ok let's try rewording it then rather than say use mdpe pipe. What pipe should I be using and what fittings do I need for copper pipe that I need to go from.

Still can't understand why someone won't give me simple answers rather than saying get someone in etc. if I wanted water leaking in my loft I'd make sure it wasn't a water tight fit. Easy enough to check and test on trial peace out of loft, if I can't get it right out of the loft I'm in trouble simple.

Still can't see why mdpe pipe can't be used though as long is its all water tight and done correctly!

Having a pipe lagged or not down the rear face of your house exposing it to the elements risks freezing and failure of the pipe.
MDPE is UV unstable, meaning when exposed to UV light eg sun light, it breaks down and weakens.
If it leaks over winter and is pouring out more water than niagra falls over the frozen patio, youre going to have to scramble up stairs whip out the loft ladder, waking up baby in process ( have a child of my own, she is a light sleeper, so i can vouch for a scenario like this) scrambling around in loft to find that damned iso valve, when its covered in attic junk, i also have an attic full of junk well you get the picture.


No despite the bother, i would lift up some floor boards, and drop it in much further down, thereby reducing the overall length of pipe, and i would keep a full bore lever iso valve in the airing cupboard so if i need to shut it off i can do so quickly and efficiently.

preferably i would aim to take the feed from the kitchen but i gather you may have concrete floors, so there be no floorboards to lift.

 

[supper plumb]

gonna take more than 2 hours to dig the trench!

mini digger sorted ill drive it throw your front door and out the back door

 

[PlumbBobBob]

mini digger sorted ill drive it throw your front door and out the back door

seen that done before now