New radiators installed, cant balance system

[Paul Mac]

Hello,

I have recently had a new extension fitted to the house. All the electrical work and plumbing etc. was dealt with by the builder as a complete job. After 3 weeks of his plumber attempting to get the system working he has walked away and left my builder and myself somewhat in the lurch.

The extension now holds 3 radiators and during the works we removed 1 so in essence we now have an additional 2 radiators in the house. I also had a new Vaillant Ecotec 831 installed 12 months ago and was serviced 2 weeks ago.

To summerise the problem the main heating in all the house seems to operate without any problems at all. The new radiators in the extension do not work properly. The main room radiator gets luke warm, the bathroom radiator takes 1+hour to even get tepid with the heating on full and the study does not get warm at all.

I have had a look around the web and resorted to try balancing the system myself however after a few hours and then eventually turning off all the radiators by the valve on each one the radiator in the new extension main room began to get hot as did the bathroom but not the study?

I have recorded some information below which may help diagnose the problem? Any help would be much appreciated.
Many thanks in advance

Paul

 

[SimonG]

What size pipework are we talking about and how as the pipework for the new extension been tied into the existing?

 

[Paul Mac]

Hello Simon,

The pipework is plastic push fit apart from some sections where the rads join. The origional feed to the radiator we took out has been used to add the 3 new ones. The pipework here goes from 10mm (ish) upto 15 to run to the new radiators and then back to 10 where it enters the rads.

The first tee of the flow is to the main room with a tee to the bathroom, then this tees off the bathroom to the study. I have attached pics original feed on RHS showing isolation valves, through wall to new rad in main room. Tee then comes to second pic through to study and down to bathroom





Kind Regards
Paul

 

[AWheating]

pipework should be clipped better and lagged and the isolation valves will cause a massive restriction and are not rated for central heating applications. the pipework to the new rads should really be run back to larger pipework section...... i would say the problem is likely the pipework as a guess.

 

[stevetheplumber]

prime example of why you should never let a builder do the plumbing i just hope he didnt have to move the boiler for this extention

 

[PlumbBobBob]

not a quality installation

 

[Subby]

As Simon has hinted at, the radiators should have been teed into the 22mm primary flow and return pipes. 10mm pipe can only carry enough water to supply one rad.

 

[LegionellaSlave]

pipework should be clipped better and lagged and the isolation valves will cause a massive restriction and are not rated for central heating applications. the pipework to the new rads should really be run back to larger pipework section...... i would say the problem is likely the pipework as a guess.

Agreed.

Shame on whoever done that pipework. :hanged:

 

[Mike Jackson]

That will never work. Proper re-pipe needed. You'll need a heating engineer that knows what he's doing rather than a fly by night who's done that work.


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[Paul Mac]

Dear Mike, Leigionella, Subby and AW.

Many thanks for taking the time to reply with some advice. I can see exactly what you are saying, it makes no sense to go from 10 to 15. Also the isolation valves never occurred to me but that too is a restriction!

Fortunately the pipework is accessible as you can see from the pictures, i will take up the floor in the room above tomorrow and chase the 10mm pipework back to source (15mm). I will then contact a local plumber to fix.

I will post back with the results but hopefully this should resolve it based on your knowledge and recommendations. The builder has sacked the plumber, im only disappointed he didn't do it sooner so I may not have been in this situation

Paul

 

[Best]

"Plumber" is probably not a plumber or a heating engineer & any builder should have known just by looking at that work that it was terrible!
10 mm is barely enough for 1 large rad & also shouldn't be run any great length. Probably needed 22mm pipe from the main pipes & then 15mm off to each rad.

 

[fuzzy]

Hello Simon,

The pipework is plastic push fit apart from some sections where the rads join. The origional feed to the radiator we took out has been used to add the 3 new ones. The pipework here goes from 10mm (ish) upto 15 to run to the new radiators and then back to 10 where it enters the rads.

The first tee of the flow is to the main room with a tee to the bathroom, then this tees off the bathroom to the study. I have attached pics original feed on RHS showing isolation valves, through wall to new rad in main room. Tee then comes to second pic through to study and down to bathroom


View attachment 7852 View attachment 7853


Kind Regards
Paul

that is appalling

 

[fuzzy]

probably undersized pipework, if so, what ever you do you will never get all rads warm at the same time

 

[mountainman]

that is appalling

An excellent and accurate description IMO.

I don't think that the builder can be up to much for allowing such shoddy pipework in the first place.
I hope the spark was at least competent :-/

 

[Paul Mac]

Hello again,

I have pulled up the floor and chased back the pipes, fortunatley the main ring can be accessed easily under the boards (Even thogh there a pig to get up). The ring is fed in 15mm pipe and i have contacted the heating engineer who put my boiler in last year who agrees with all your advice on here.
(He even wants to pursue the prankster who installed it to check he's blacklisted locally, he took pics etc.)

So 15mm pipework is to be connected into the 15mm pipework on the main pipework the isolation valves are to be removed and straight connectors put in.

Again i will let you all know how it goes, and thanks again for your assistance so far,

Paul