Discuss Firebird sooted up suddenly in the Central Heating Forum area at PlumbersForums.net

Messages
3
Hi all, came across this forum this looking for information on my sooting up kitchen type indoor Enviromax. I'm a retired electronics/maintenance engineer, (fwiw can answer questions on popular smart home thermostat systems), but I've installed many solid fuel boilers in the last 40 years for family, and a few oil boiler swapouts also.
My Enviromax sooted up quite suddenly last week. I have it running again after a few false starts, I think my issues are with the difficulty cleaning the back chamber from the turbulator tubes up to the flue connector. It ran perfectly for over 4 years, never more than some fine ash on the baffles when I'd inspect it, but then last year It developed a squeaking noise from the motor, possibly a bearing or stator rubbing. Before I got around to dealing with it I had a serious failure, lots of soot, baked photocell. Also disintegration on the top of the condenser trap, some minor burning of the top two baffles on the rear edge, and the door sĺeal was in a bad way. A full overhaul, two new baffles, motor, photocell, nozzle, trap, got it running again, just in time for Xmas, and it was running perfectly till last week, when it sooted up and set off the CO alarm.
I'm thinking that I didn't get enough soot from the back chamber last November, I used a vacuum and a length of hose though the tubes, followed by a spirity rag on a stick. Does soapy hot water down the top flue exit sound like a plan? Let it drain through the condensate trap. Or perhaps DualX.
I've set it slightly lean of manufacturers factory setting, from 2.5 to 2.6 on the air intake. It smells a bit, I'm thinking back pressure from the back flue maybe pushing gas out somewhere. Its not balanced due to location, it vents up the old boiler's flue chimney with stainless extension pipes inserted to the top, and draws its air in from the supplied balanced flue intake kit which is now indoors, but sited in a large cavity in the base if the old chimney. Its at the limit of the vertical flue length mentioned in some Firebird condenser manuals, at 6m. Back in 2017 the firebird guy said it was OK to extend the exhaust flue, a 45° on the end of the included balanced kit and the required number of ext tubes inside the old earthenware liners. I wonder does this extension affect the air setting required. Maybe I should remove the flap from the intake snorkel, some are saying it can cause issues, though it looked fine to me. As the intake is indoors I was happy to have it to stop downdraft entering the utility room when the boiler was off.
Any advice appreciated. Once I get it staying clean, I'll get a chap in with the oil pressure/CO2 meters to fine tune.
 
It's a combustion appliance. Doesnt matter if you're a rocket scientist, unless you're competent then stop fiddling with something that can kill you.
Get the man/woman in with the right gear to set it up both safely and efficiently.
 
If it's set of the CO alarm, then as well as incomplete combustion, you have combustion products entering the room. Which theoretically shouldn't happen. You say the intake is indoors - I wonder if the room has the very large vents to the design that regulations require. You need to remember that the more efficient the boiler, the less heat to drive a natural draught up a chimney.

With all respect, because you sound skilled if not entirely competent with oil burners, you're tinkering with what if I fiddle with this that or the other element of the installation and now talking about removing a backdraught (safety?!) device that the manufacturer presumably thought was necessary, and I think you're barking up the wrong tree because if it worked before, then it should still work now, and if is a safety device, then it shouldn't be removed. Ever.

I'm usually the last to say this on the grounds that if a skilled person cleans something out then it's usually better than nothing even if he's not a 'competent person', then if you have doubts about how well you've got it clean, then it's a job for a professional who will (if you find a good one) have the correct equipment and experience to get the flueways clean on that model. Once it's properly set up and serviced, then it will be much easier to identify installation issues.
 
If it's set of the CO alarm, then as well as incomplete combustion, you have combustion products entering the room. Which theoretically shouldn't happen. You say the intake is indoors - I wonder if the room has the very large vents to the design that regulations require. You need to remember that the more efficient the boiler, the less heat to drive a natural draught up a chimney.

With all respect, because you sound skilled if not entirely competent with oil burners, you're tinkering with what if I fiddle with this that or the other element of the installation and now talking about removing a backdraught (safety?!) device that the manufacturer presumably thought was necessary, and I think you're barking up the wrong tree because if it worked before, then it should still work now, and if is a safety device, then it shouldn't be removed. Ever.

I'm usually the last to say this on the grounds that if a skilled person cleans something out then it's usually better than nothing even if he's not a 'competent person', then if you have doubts about how well you've got it clean, then it's a job for a professional who will (if you find a good one) have the correct equipment and experience to get the flueways clean on that model. Once it's properly set up and serviced, then it will be much easier to identify installation issues.
Thanks for your comments @Ric2013, it's an old query, but it's all sorted. I found out what caused the sudden recurrence of the sooting, despite it working fine for weeks after a thorough cleanout and new motor/baffles/seals/nozzle replacement. I had some 'professionals' in to clean the moss encrusted roof soon after, and one of them leaned or sat on the chimney where the stainless flue insert protrudes, and managed to push it in nearly flush. It has a cowl cap, so the flue was restricted, hence incomplete combustion for a completely different reason than my first failure (iffy motor). What are the chances? They also left me with leaks from damaged tiles, and it was when I went up on the roof to investigate that I copped the pushed in flue and cowl. Everything is in order now. Boiler has been used sparingly due to the energy costs, but I have a dual system with a wood boiler stove and NRG system neutraliser I installed years ago, and I've a lot of on site timber which I cut, so oil boiler use will be minimised. Nonetheless, I'll get a guy in with the analyser to tune and adjust it for the coming winter.
 
I had some 'professionals' in to clean the moss encrusted roof soon after, and one of them leaned or sat on the chimney where the stainless flue insert protrudes, and managed to push it in nearly flush.
This is the reason that I have more time than most for people doing DIY work. Some 'professionals'...
 

Reply to Firebird sooted up suddenly in the Central Heating Forum area at PlumbersForums.net

Similar plumbing topics

Hi Just looking for some suggestions on what to look for/try next. Up until last weekend, our oil fired boiler central heating was working fine...
Replies
0
Views
1K
Hi, We had our annual oil burner service carried out by a well known Norfolk firm last Thursday and all was great for a day. Came home from work...
Replies
3
Views
2K
WB 4000 installed a few months back, just balanced the 7 rads - managed to get around 15 degrees delta across most rads. Not quite the 20 degrees...
Replies
2
Views
628
Hi All, In Dec 2023 I had my annual boiler service and asked the plumber to change 2 radiator valves as the radiator in the toilet downstairs was...
Replies
7
Views
526
Hi all I really need some help or advise….. Back story….. Some years ago my dad had an extension to his house which included a newly built...
Replies
2
Views
348

Newest Plumbing Threads

Back
Top
AdBlock Detected

We get it, advertisements are annoying!

Sure, ad-blocking software does a great job at blocking ads, but it also blocks useful features of our website. For the best site experience please disable your AdBlocker.

I've Disabled AdBlock