Boiler Heat Exchanger busted

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Suzan

Suzan

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92
Hi guys,

Quick question. Had 2 new rads fitted (system was drained) but I didn't test the hot water or heating after he fitted the rads. 4-5 days later I noticed there was no hot water (wasn't in the house) and I kept hearing clanging sounds after the boiler has tried to ignite then shutdown. Only rad that got hot when heating was turned on is one above boiler, rad in the room next to it got a bit hot when i turned the first one off but not fully hot. Plumber came round and said f&e tank was contaminated and when the system got drained, sludge may have gone into the system and caused the heat exchanger in the boiler to overheat. He cut the boiler off from the gas and just labeled it not usable.

So I have a couple of options. I was gonna go with buying a combi boiler that will require the system be drained and flushed anyway, and he said the current boiler is beyond repair because the heat exchanger is expensive.

I saw on ebay a refurb for £55, and I'm thinking, can we not just power flush the system, then install the new heat exchanger, make sure the f&e tank has no gunk, and all good? Or is this a bad idea? This is a vented system btw. Picture of boiler is attached (worcester bosch greenstar 24 ri)

IMG-20190610-WA0004.jpeg
 
That is cheap for them. So let me get this straight they came out replaced the radiators for you? Stirred up a load of muck in the system and then cut you off saying the boiler is unsafe. I would be more inclined to think it’s an airlock if some of the radiators are getting some warmth
 
No i got a gasman previously to come out and install 2 rads. Few days later i realised there was no hot water or anything. My mate thought it was an airlock but we bled all radiators, no air. Some radiators were indeed getting warm, but warm on the top, not the bottom.
 
So there is a likelihood that there is some sludge stirred up, but if they are getting warm that means that the boiler is producing heat ?? Why did you not get the initial plumber back?
 
Well For a start I would be complaining to Pimlico as an airlock or sludge in the system does not warrant treating the boiler as immediately dangerous and cutting the gas. My point still remains though if the radiators are getting warm then the boiler is producing heat albeit badly. Tried shutting off all radiators bar one and forcing the heat to that. I would still be inclined to think that it’s air
 
Get on the phone to them and complain. Ask them how they’ve got to the answer of immediately dangerous
 
Of what???? I think there’s more to this. Did they leave you a report of why it was capped off
 
First of all, Pimlico are notorious for ripping off customers and making up faults to get more work, the engineers are told to pull the wool over the customers eyes.

As Riley said, poor circulation does not warrant your boiler to be condemned unless there's more going on then whats mentioned
 
My OH has it on his email but I read it. It basically said f&e tank was contaminated, he went to drain the system down but saw the heat exchanger on the boiler and said this is dangerous because the seal has gone. Report says there were clanging noises (he asked me how i'd describe the noise and he wrote it down).
 
Tbh i don't see why I can't just get a refurb heat exchanger for it, drain the system down/power flush/clean f&e, and fit heat exchanger to the boiler. There were no faults on the boiler - stayed solid blue, just burner indicator started and then stopped (probably recognised blockage?)
 
Given how this problem started after a draindown It's probably more likely an air lock or pump failure. Not saying your system isn't sludged as it might be. But yes it can be flushed. And I don't work on Worcesters so can say for sure but the seal on the top should be replaceable. If not you can replace the heat ex. I wouldnt recommend a refurb off eBay though. A new one Will set you back around £350 + fitting. Not cheap but certainly cheaper than a new boiler.
 
I mean I'd like to think that plumber had some idea of what he was doing. Things sounded like they were working ok but because of a blockage (you can hear the pipes clanging) the igniter stopped. Bled all radiators and nothing, water was lukewarm but not hot hot and that was in the bathroom and kitchen. So don't think it's air as I vented it even from the circulation pump. Got a Wilo Yonos Pico and it is spinning and working fine (near the hot water cylinder). The plumber said it is the heat ex and I spoke to Bosch and they said they cover that just 120 for labour costs. Not sure if they'll solder the gas pipe the plumber cut off tho ¬_¬
 
This is from the PP today

"To attend to above property to assess no heating and no hot water. On inspection Worcester Bosch heat only boiler found to be firing but running for a short time before cutting out. System has recently been worked on by a third party.On removal of boiler cover main heat exchanger found to be showing signs of overheating. Burner case seal also found to be unserviceable. System found to have circulation problems. FE tank also found to be contaminated. Advised client that the boiler is beyond economical repair. To isolate gas supply to boiler and make safe. To issue warning advice notice and warning label attached. Recommendations are Powerflush system replace boiler with ideal heat only boiler with system filter new pump"
 
I’d still be saying airlock and boiler needs some TLC. Burner case seal unserviceable?? What the hell does that mean
 
Is it bad to replace the heat exchanger though? Need to get it power flushed before that though otherwise sludge may go into the new heat exchanger we get fitted. Power flush should remove airlock/sludge right?
 
I'm not ignoring I'm saying would it be a bad idea to do that since the heat exchanger needs replacing :\... The plumber said it's sludge but I thought it was air initially. I bled all radiators so no air in there, so that's why I'm asking if a power flush would remove an airlock? because how else are we to remove an air lock... :\
 
Removing air from radiators doesn't remove airlocks. Did you have any issues with the system prior to draining down? If the initial plumber hasn't vented and ran your system properly he's most likely knackered the pump.
 
There were issues prior i.e. when I opened the bath tap for hot water sometimes nothing would come out for a sec then a big *plop* (sorry didn't know how else to describe this!) then water, then more blobs of air etc. That has happened ever since I removed a rad a year ago tbh. There's always been a build up of air hanging around... When the plumber checked it today though he said the pump is fine and motor was spinning fine.
 
I’m not saying it’s not spot on mate just something doesn’t add up with this. It’s just vague personified
 
Riley said:
I’m not saying it’s not spot on mate just something doesn’t add up with this. It’s just vague personified
Click to expand...
Didn’t intendto state that your in the wrong either mate. Just a different take on it that’s all. This heat ex is 100% leaking here, and if it is dripping near electrics (not saying it is) that would also be ID.

Also the cover above the fan is missing.

2A4D7A20-3097-426E-9316-83EEDEB367E0.jpeg
 
Tbh that boiler hasn't been touched since ages ago so don't know where the cover went (there's a cover on the floor below the boiler but i'm guessing that's not it......). Anyway this is a close-up of the top of the heat exchanger

Screenshot_20190610-192045.png
 
Well Bosch are saying they will come round and charge £315 in total to change anything that is needed to be changed? That includes heat exchanger, pump, etc. Would that be a good option?
 
If products of combustion were detected to be escaping the casing of the boiler then ID.
Easy to assume the worst with the reputation that goes along with your chosen company.

It's near impossible to diagnose the circulation issue precisely without being at the property.
There's an air release valve to bleed air from heat exchanger which may of not been used when refilling the system, which could be a contributing factor in the issue but definitely not the cause of the signs of heat stress and leaking present on heat exchanger.

Pipe shouldn't of been cut for what can be seen in pictures alone, as at face value it appears to be classed as "At Risk" which would still justify advice of turning off and not to use, but not physical disconnection of the gas supply.

Ultimately though the heat exchanger issue should definitely be attended to first. The heat exchanger is showing signs of excessive heat with the ribbing being quite apparent.

I'd get priced up (from a different company preferably) for heat exchanger renewal (along with burner seals etc) and request a water quality test to determine if a flush is also required.

Once you've got that information you need I'd then still consider the option of replacing the boiler purely from a financial perspective due to potential warranty benefits of changing it out for new.

If it were in my house id change the boiler but can understand why it is more suited to others to replace only the heat exchanger etc.
 
Thanks Mastermixlee, I can get someone to come round and potentially do a water quality test/a flush. The plumber who put the rad in said he could refill the system with a cleaning chemical, and let it run through. He then spoke of adding a magnaclean. Bosch advised this should all be done before I call them out to get a new heat exchanger installed (along with anything else that boiler might need).
 
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