Compatible gas control valve for obsolete Honeywell

[BruceK]

After the success of yesterday's posting, and the constructive support I received I wonder if I could please test the skills of the wise again, as today I've a problem of my own to resolve.
I called out a gas engineer this morning because our boiler, an elderly Ideal Concord CX 240 P, has started 'popping' loudly on extinguishing, sometimes blowing out the pilot light. He checked the LPG pressure on the manifold, which was okay, as was the strength of the pilot flame and, with the front cover removed the flame died out quietly, making it look like I was inventing the problem. However, when he replaced the cover it started popping again.
His next suggestion, which seems logical, is a weak diaphragm in the gas control valve, or a weak/broken spring, causing a slow, rather than immediate cut-off of gas. Apparently this valve (Honeywell type V4400D 1011) is now obsolete but he said that if I can track one down, or find another that is compatible, or even get hold of a replacement diaphragm and spring, he'll come and fit it for me, but he's too busy to spend hours doing an online search so that's my task.
I've come across a Honeywell V4400C 1211 which, according to the advertiser's table, is supposed to fit the Concord CX 240P but I cant see a compatibility reference anywhere else so wanted to check to see if anyone knows anything different or can point me in the right direction. These valves cost over £300 so I'd prefer not to spend all that money buying the wrong one.
I've just been reading about a potential safety issue with broken springs on the V4400C series. This evening I've sent off an email to Ideal to see whether they can help.
I'm also wondering if there might be another reason for the popping, which is obviously something to do with the air/propane mix.
All suggestions would be gratefully received.

 

[Rob Foster]

Try Ignite Heat Spares they do all sorts of re furnished stuff, let me know if they can help you
Rob Foster aka centralheatking

 

[BruceK]

Try Ignite Heat Spares they do all sorts of re furnished stuff, let me know if they can help you
Rob Foster aka centralheatking

Another almost immediate response! Thanks Rob. I've sent off an inquiry to Ignite and will let you know the outcome.
BK

 

[Last Plumber]

Your Gas Engineer should be the one looking to find a replacement in all fairness, if he is prepared to repair it. He will know what the Gas valve is required to do.
There are lots of 1/2" or 3/4" multi-functional Gas valves out there as you no doubt are aware but a lot have different features required by the Boiler manufacturer.
The Boiler is old and a lot of the parts are now obsolete. I know it's not what you want to hear but I think it is time to say farewell to an old reliable friend. It has served you well.

 

[BruceK]

Your Gas Engineer should be the one looking to find a replacement in all fairness, if he is prepared to repair it. He will know what the Gas valve is required to do.
There are lots of 1/2" or 3/4" multi-functional Gas valves out there as you no doubt are aware but a lot have different features required by the Boiler manufacturer.
The Boiler is old and a lot of the parts are now obsolete. I know it's not what you want to hear but I think it is time to say farewell to an old reliable friend. It has served you well.

Thanks for your input, Last Plumber, I appreciate your suggestions. I take your point but I'm an oldie (as well as being tight-fisted) and throwing away something which is otherwise perfectly good, just for the sake of a new diaphragm, really goes against the grain. My HE agrees that these boilers are worth keeping, even though they're less efficient than new ones. They are simple to service, don't suffer from problems with condensation (pilot light sees to that), the fans don't pack up every 5 minutes, the burners are still as new, and the new super-efficient boilers have a much more limited life expectancy. If I can get it fixed I will. Who knows; it could repay me by lasting another 25 years! If I need to replace it then I'll be delighted, as I'll be 94 by then!
The heating engineer told me that he'd be very happy to fit the parts, but it wasn't worth his while surfing the net to track them down. I'm happy with that, because he'll come and fit it and just charge me for his time. It's just finding the right bits...….

 

[BruceK]

Try Ignite Heat Spares they do all sorts of re furnished stuff, let me know if they can help you
Rob Foster aka centralheatking

Just an update, as promised. I contacted Ignite, who couldn't answer my query but were very helpful in giving me the contact number for Honeywell. I then spoke to a very nice Honeywell lady, somewhere in India I think, who brickwalled me, saying they only produced valves for the manufacturers and that I would have to contact Ideal, which I'd already done.
I then contacted idealpartsonlineUK (aka AK) who are advertising the valve as being suitable for my boiler and asked the girl to check compatibility. She checked, then said she thought there must be a mistake on their advert (could be a dangerous mistake?) because it gave different type numbers for the NG and LPG valves and my LPG valve was obsolete, which I already knew. AAAAAGH!!
I then spoke to another guy who was advertising Honeywell gas valves online and he suggested it might just be the solenoid not closing the valve properly, so that's the direction I'm heading in right now.

 

[Last Plumber]

Just an update, as promised. I contacted Ignite, who couldn't answer my query but were very helpful in giving me the contact number for Honeywell. I then spoke to a very nice Honeywell lady, somewhere in India I think, who brickwalled me, saying they only produced valves for the manufacturers and that I would have to contact Ideal, which I'd already done.
I then contacted idealpartsonlineUK (aka AK) who are advertising the valve as being suitable for my boiler and asked the girl to check compatibility. She checked, then said she thought there must be a mistake on their advert (could be a dangerous mistake?) because it gave different type numbers for the NG and LPG valves and my LPG valve was obsolete, which I already knew. AAAAAGH!!
I then spoke to another guy who was advertising Honeywell gas valves online and he suggested it might just be the solenoid not closing the valve properly, so that's the direction I'm heading in right now.

It might not be the Gas Valve.
I know you don't want to change the Boiler but in my experience, the time has come.
Even if you track down a Gas valve that is made for the job, you could find it was not that after all and be back to square one. Old Boilers with obsolete parts are a nightmare.

My gut feeling for what it's worth, is that it is not what you think it is.

 

[Rob Foster]

Just an update, as promised. I contacted Ignite, who couldn't answer my query but were very helpful in giving me the contact number for Honeywell. I then spoke to a very nice Honeywell lady, somewhere in India I think, who brickwalled me, saying they only produced valves for the manufacturers and that I would have to contact Ideal, which I'd already done.
I then contacted idealpartsonlineUK (aka AK) who are advertising the valve as being suitable for my boiler and asked the girl to check compatibility. She checked, then said she thought there must be a mistake on their advert (could be a dangerous mistake?) because it gave different type numbers for the NG and LPG valves and my LPG valve was obsolete, which I already knew. AAAAAGH!!
I then spoke to another guy who was advertising Honeywell gas valves online and he suggested it might just be the solenoid not closing the valve properly, so that's the direction I'm heading in right now.

I know the head if Oem Honeywell uk so if your quest stalls let me know , he might be ok to help...centralheatking

 

[fixitflav]

he suggested it might just be the solenoid not closing the valve properly

If it is the solenoid valve this might help. My boiler stopped firing last year and I tracked it down to one of the 2 solenoids on the gas valve, which had gone open circuit. On the internet I found Solenoid Valves UK, who do a live chat. Gave them the dia and length of the tube thing the solenoid mounts on and they quoted their nearest, less than £12 so well worth it just as a test. When it came it fitted OK but the connector was in the wrong place and I had to do a temporary (but perfectly safe!) wiring mod. Everything then fine. It took a few weeks to get the right replacement from Italy, which cost £37 by the time various outfits had taken a cut.
I was impressed by Solenoid Valves UK, it might be worth contacting them if that is your problem. Though perhaps unlikely as the solenoid opens the valve, it's spring close so if dodgy closing is the issue the solenoid probably isn't the culprit.

 

[Rob Foster]

If it is the solenoid valve this might help. My boiler stopped firing last year and I tracked it down to one of the 2 solenoids on the gas valve, which had gone open circuit. On the internet I found Solenoid Valves UK, who do a live chat. Gave them the dia and length of the tube thing the solenoid mounts on and they quoted their nearest, less than £12 so well worth it just as a test. When it came it fitted OK but the connector was in the wrong place and I had to a temporary (but perfectly safe!) wiring mod. Everything then fine. It took a few weeks to get the right replacement from Italy, which cost £37 by the time various outfits had taken a cut.
I was impressed by Solenoid Valves UK, it might be worth contacting them if that is your problem.

Nice one I will keep a record
Thank you. Chking