Central heating leak found but not sure about how the plumber has welded the pipes

[cammy0102]

Hi guys,
After some quick advice as my builder's plumber is about to finish hte job.

Basically I had a leak in the central heating system (it's all brand new and the combi boiler started losing water pressure few months ago and it gradually got worse) after months of looking for it, I think tey'v efound the issue. It was a small leak under the bath and yesterday when they removed the bath and dug out to expose the pipes they foudn the leak.

The leak was in a T junction of one of the big copper pipes (22mm I think) and the drain (to empty water in central heating pipes) going outside the bathroom/house. This new plumber used by my builder/contractor yesterday created this apparatus to connect a compression meter and left it overnight. This morning we found there was no pressure loss in the combi boiler (phew!) and the plumber said the compression test passed. So we know that small leak was what was causing the loss in water pressure.

Anyway this morning the plumber left pretty much all of the apparatus but I am not entirely happy with it so wanted hear expert opinion. There are lots of joints in there (probalby 5,6) plus he's got joints going from big diameter pipe (probably 22mm) to small diameter copper pipe (probably 15mm) back to big diameter pipe. I've read that leaks are likely to happen in joints and the more joints you have surely the more chance of future leaks?

What do you think of this work? See picture attached. You can see how it was before and how it is now.
I probably prefer it to one straight pipe like before (but without the leak obviously)

Thanks guys.





http://*********/a/rPVWp

 

[cammy0102]

Re: Central heating leak found but not sure about how the plumber has welded the pipe

My plumber friend told me that central heating pipes should ideally be insulated everywhere not just under concrete to avoid heat loss. I know they are definitely not insulated rest of the house where the pipes are running under floor joists.

This is bloody frustrating. All they had to do was ask me for insulation - I was paying for all the material and the price they were charging was for labour.

I did see some grey foam insulation tubes in the kitchen so maybe he insulated the pipes under kitchen floor but not sure about the living room as I wasn't there when they did it. Is this the right insulation type?

The crappy plumber that 'fixed' the leak in the bathroom covered the pipes with this brown fibrous long strip. Not sure if it's any good?

 

[Riley]

Re: Central heating leak found but not sure about how the plumber has welded the pipe

Inconvenience over potential floods and damage to yours and your neighbours property and massive insurance claims. I know which way I'd be looking. Plus if something goes wrong within the 12 month "guarantee" period offered you by your builder youll still be having floors up and damage caused. Please don't think we don't understand as most of us on here are experienced and know what should be involved in a decent install. It sound to me like your boys have cut corners and that this is the tip of the iceberg in terms of trouble for you. I'd either be getting it done now or getting some money back from your builder now

 

[king of pipes]

Re: Central heating leak found but not sure about how the plumber has welded the pipe

We all feel for you mate but there really is no excuse for poor workmanship you paid good money for your project, your builder employed these people it is his responsibility to make sure they are qualified, supervised and experienced in the trade you are only as good as your last job this could reflex very badly on his business, I myself rely on recommendation for all my work never had to advertise I had 30 years working for a company and 5 more as a sole trader and I am always busy because I break my balls giving my customers a good job , I can't help you anymore than that mate i hope you resolve your problems regards k

 

[cammy0102]

Re: Central heating leak found but not sure about how the plumber has welded the pipe

Gents, could you please reply to this?

My plumber friend told me that central heating pipes should ideally be insulated everywhere not just under concrete to avoid heat loss. I know they are definitely not insulated rest of the house where the pipes are running under floor joists.

This is bloody frustrating. All they had to do was ask me for insulation - I was paying for all the material and the price they were charging was for labour.

I did see some grey foam insulation tubes in the kitchen so maybe he insulated the pipes under kitchen floor but not sure about the living room as I wasn't there when they did it. Is this the right insulation type?

The crappy plumber that 'fixed' the leak in the bathroom covered the pipes with this brown fibrous long strip. Not sure if it's any good?

 

[king of pipes]

Re: Central heating leak found but not sure about how the plumber has welded the pipe

That would have been hair felt lagging bud not the best but better than nothing in a ideal world insulate where you can under the joisted floors but its not essential, around boilers and cylinders is a building regulation , always insulate pipework under concrete or screed floors no excuse not to .

 

[Radioman]

Re: Central heating leak found but not sure about how the plumber has welded the pipe

In your previous post you where advised to obtain a copy of your builders public liability insurance plus the same for each self employed subcontractor. Did you do this or not? If no why? If yes then I suggest if your builder does not comply with rectification as suggested above you start a claim. As Croppie says, caveat emptor. And building controls should have been involved from day one.

 

[joni os]

Re: Central heating leak found but not sure about how the plumber has welded the pipe

Gents, could you please reply to this?

Wouldn't get too vexed about lack of insulation between ground floor and upper ceiling, Any heat loss remains within the structure. Different for ventilated spaces, such as suspended ground floor.

 

[joni os]

Re: Central heating leak found but not sure about how the plumber has welded the pipe

Gents, could you please reply to this?

Wouldn't get too vexed about lack of insulation between ground floor and upper ceiling, Any heat loss remains within the structure. Different for ventilated spaces, such as suspended ground floor.

 

[cammy0102]

Re: Central heating leak found but not sure about how the plumber has welded the pipe

Double post

 

[cammy0102]

Re: Central heating leak found but not sure about how the plumber has welded the pipe

Wouldn't get too vexed about lack of insulation between ground floor and upper ceiling, Any heat loss remains within the structure. Different for ventilated spaces, such as suspended ground floor.

I'm in the ground floor so the pipes running under floor joists could be losing heat in the sub floor (this was mentioned by my plumber friend last night) but this is least of my problems at the moment.

It seems the hair felt lagging the new plumber used in the bathroom to insulate the pipes is not the right stuff to use in concrete? Quick googling suggests it's not waterproof so concrete could still eat in to the pipes.

I've had a chat to another builder who I know uses qualified plumbers, electricians. He said write a polite email to the my builder/contractor and ask him to maybe re-do the pipework in the bathroom. He also said not to threaten to go the courts and keep a good relationship as the builder has been cooperating so far and has promised to fix problems. As soon as I take him to small claims court he'll stop fixing any problems and I certainly won't be able to get small claims court to order him to pay for a new refurbishment to rip out everything and re-do it all as it will cost tens of thousands.

Edit - This is a Victorian period conversion.

 

[Radioman]

Re: Central heating leak found but not sure about how the plumber has welded the pipe

The advice was a claim against his insurers via his PLI. Taking a trader to SCC is a last resort when all else fails.