Ancient gas fire/BBU

[leelister6]

Have a customer with a New World Stowaway gas fire and BBU. BG fitted em a new combi and decomissioned the old fire and BBU. The customer now wants the fire reinstating. New World no longer does boilers and fires so can't get a straight answer from them whether it can be done. Tried Gas Safe's tech helpline and I might as well have phoned me Gran! The flue is sound and has passed the flue flow test (both through the BBU heat ex. and the fire spigot entry). The fire is in excellent condition (35 years old!) so just wanting some opinions on whether I should just go ahead and connect the gas supply to the fire, do all the relevant tests and Bob's your uncle. Should the burner tray be removed or should it be left in situ? Any advice will be greatly appreciated.

 

[jtsplumbing]

Hello mate what you have to do is remove gas and elec connections burners ect from BBU , disconnect any pipework from back boiler and leave open ends, BG have been drilling holes into BBU. CORGI did write a page on doing this.

 

[Puddle]

The back boiler and fire are all part of the same unit,you can not have part of the unit operational without the manufacturers approval,this you can not get,so the answer is no ,you should not re-instate fire by it's self as officially it is not a stand alone fire but part of an appliance that incorporates a fire and boiler unit,gas safe should have pointed this out but as you say know they just pass the buck

We used to do as jts says however now even Baxi have now saying it is ok to have their fires on their back boiler units operational by themselves with bbu decommissioned and isolated .

Think you should recommend the customer has a new more efficient fire fitted

imho

 

[jtsplumbing]

We did loads of these for plymouth council , who got method pass`d by corgi as long as BBU is still in place and connected to flue it was accepted, As for gas safe trying to get an answer from them, waste of time, try your local inspector he may have more information, BG are still doing this, so who is right and who is wrong ??

 

[gasmarc]

I would say no is the answer imho

 

[GrahamM]

Does not mater what Gas Safe or Corgi say. They are not the experts here.
Without manufacturers approval it is a no no.

 

[Gordon T]

As GrahamM states its not upto Gas Safe to give a yes or no. If the manufacturer says yes, get them to say so with a letter of approval. Do not dismiss this. If they say no, then its a definate NO, irrespective of which other body is telling you otherwise. Gas Safe dont overide any manufacturers ruling.

 

[wnjswozo]

was told years ago,and i dont think its changed you can use fire as long as bbu still in place,as fire slots into boiler flue hood,which in turn (or should be)is connected to flue liner.
i personnally would talk them into having bbu/gf took out and new fire fitted,lay it on about existing fire not having asd ,they,ll soon come round,you know it makes sense

 

[5544]

as stated earlier, you cannot just re commission the fire on its own, unless the manufacturer states it is possible. the back boiler and fire are considered one unit, and the instalation and testing is done with that in mind. if you cannot get a clear answer from the manufacturer, forget it and tell them to get a stand alone fire.

 

[Mike Jackson]

Check out TB091 on the Gas Safe Register site. Tells you everything you need to know.

 

[Mbear]

Don't see anything wrong with it myself aslong as....

The flue is passing its f/f and is in perfect condition.
Ventilation is satisfactory.
U have the mi available to commission fire.
The back boiler is still in-situ, gas/elects/pipes disconnected.
All tightness tests and further gas leak checks are sound.

I don't see the problem with it at all. In theory (if both bbu&fire worked) a user could use the fire on its own and never use the boiler if they so wished, there would be no issue with that.

 

[gasmarc]

you could argue the point that there is no FFD or plus the integrity of a flue that is what 35 years old :hammer:

 

[jtsplumbing]

If everything is working OK flue ect would you class fire as NTS, and fit CO alarm, may-be this is eldery customer who can-not afford a new fire, How meny gas fires are fitted in the uk with-out FFD , been in for years never had a problem.

 

[gasmarc]

I agree with what you are saying I am just being anorak and covering oneself

 

[Billy Bob Bob]

we all know manufacturers wont commit to this one,even BAXI say no but you can if you take responsibility,however the liners 35 year old it will be like a colander out of site ,just do your custard a favor yes i can do it but the liner needs replacing or a better option upgrade to a new fire

 

[kirkgas]

was told years ago,and i dont think its changed you can use fire as long as bbu still in place,as fire slots into boiler flue hood,which in turn (or should be)is connected to flue liner.
i personnally would talk them into having bbu/gf took out and new fire fitted,lay it on about existing fire not having asd ,they,ll soon come round,you know it makes sense

sorry i dont agree with you, i have also been told yrs ago that you could do it with baxi, then they said you cant, so the bottom line is they are all different and you must have specific instruction from each manufacturer about each model

 

[kirkgas]

We did loads of these for plymouth council , who got method pass`d by corgi as long as BBU is still in place and connected to flue it was accepted, As for gas safe trying to get an answer from them, waste of time, try your local inspector he may have more information, BG are still doing this, so who is right and who is wrong ??

it always amazes me when someone quotes that BG are doing it, who cares what they are doig they are no better or worse than anyone else in parts, they are just a gas contractor,

 

[kirkgas]

Don't see anything wrong with it myself aslong as....

The flue is passing its f/f and is in perfect condition.
Ventilation is satisfactory.
U have the mi available to commission fire.
The back boiler is still in-situ, gas/elects/pipes disconnected.
All tightness tests and further gas leak checks are sound.

I don't see the problem with it at all. In theory (if both bbu&fire worked) a user could use the fire on its own and never use the boiler if they so wished, there would be no issue with that.

the difference is that they were designed and fitted as a combined unit can you guarantee that the manufacturer is ok with the fire being used on its own? i appreciate the punter could originally use the fire, the boiler or both as and when they like, but like everything else over the last few yrs, everyone is scared of the claim culture our yankee cousins have sent over to us and "just in case" something goes wrong it is sometimes easier to say "no you cant do that" i understand why people say no but agree that if they do say no then no it is and the fire cannot be used on its own

 

[gasmarc]

As you say just because BG do it , That is no yardstick to measure anything by as they employ some idiots who have proved that by killing there customers. The answer is still no imho , Maybe think to yourself if it was your parents would you do it ?

 

[leelister6]

The flue liner looks quite new when I stick my head up the chimley. The problem is they are an old couple with not a lot of money and the wall that the fire is on is all Yorkshire slate. Will try and get some sense out of New World later. Thanks for all your replies.

 

[gasmarc]

is it not suppose to have a registerplate or insulation from memory

 

[kirkgas]

is it not suppose to have a registerplate or insulation from memory

maybe it has and he looked up the inside of the liner

 

[gasmarc]

Good point , I have been down this road years ago with the same issue , Even then it was a nightmare. I have just had an estate agent on the phone looking for a service record for a property as the new buyer wont sign until they have it , I have spoken to the customer and told them I am giving thapes any paperwork as I had not serviced it ever and I only did breakdowns on it cheeky mare