PowerFlushing?

[Householder]

Hi there,

I recently commissioned a Heating Engineer to replace my ancient 29 year old Potterton Boiler with a new Vaillant Ecotec 418 Open Vent system. Part of the Quote included PowerFlushing the Central Heating System.

His definition of PowerFlushing was to locate a special pumping machine on the landing of the house, remove the circulation Pump and fit two connectors in its place. They he spent over two hours pumping the water around the system, opening one radiator at the time. At the end of the process, he opened the drain valve and allowed gravity to empty the system until clean water flowed through.

I've just watched a Fernox video describing the PowerFlushing process and to my mind my Plumber didn't PowerFlush the system at all! In fact all he did was to pump water around the system moving any sludge and debris from one radiator to the next. At the end, no PowerFlushing was involved, only gravity was used to flush the system.

From what I understand, instead of simply recirculating the dirty water from the machine straight back into the system, he should have had a clean water inlet and dirty water outlet attached to the PowerFlushing machine. This was not done.

Please can an expert advise if I've misunderstood something here? Or am I correct in my understanding that you can't actually PowerFlush a system unless you use the special pump to force clear water through the relevant part of the system allowing an equivalent amount of dirty water to exit into a drain.

Looking forward to your replies ASAP because the Engineer is due back this afternoon and I'm considering asking him to PowerFlush the system again, properly this time.

Best regards,

Householder

 

[ed209]

It was a bit early when I wrote that Jeff
But I have found x800 to be very effective and was not suggesting you put it in a stubborn system just one that is functioning reasonably well just to further cleans it. The power flush bit got me when you now have the additional magnet filter option, this says to me that power flushing without is not very effective or is it to speed the process up?
But as stated a proper day long power flush can add a lot to a boiler change.
Money you would be better off spending on a chemical flush through and a decent in line filter on the rerun pipe that works as the rads/pipe/fittings/boiler breakdown internally over the years
But just my opinion I'm always interested in other methods that I have read on here and other forums.

 

[ed209]

Sentinel now do X400 which is designed to stay in the system and work in conjunction with a filter
I have no connection with Sentinel by the way

 

[AWheating]

a powerflush machine works alot better than just a chem because of the extra flow rate/movement in the system created by the machine.

in many cleaning processes the use of a combination of cleaning chemicals, heat and movement are the ideal/ best method. think of your washing machine using a cleaner, adding and warming water and spinning it around as an example.

one way of looking at it is.......... you want to clean some dirty slabs, you mix a cleaner in hot water and apply it on the slabs to let it loosen the dirt. You then can either swill it off with a bucket of water or use your garden hose with mains pressure. not a very good example i grant you

 

[ed209]

Well I suppose that was was I was getting at by putting the chemicals in and heating the water and movement around the system for a couple of days or more by the pump running the boiler, then a complete drain down.
I'm not anti power flush and have used mine very successfully where necessary.

 

[JeffD]

Yes everyone to there own, I just think a boiler won't move iron oxide like a flushing machine will but if it works for you then that's all that matters.

 

[chris watkins]

I am a bit late to this one, sorry but why the hell is the OP not talking to their engineer about what they have done ?

It kills me when they select a professional to carry out work of them, have them do it, then come on here asking the in's & out's of a technical subject without speaking to the person they are employing first. What do they want ammunition !!!

By all means ask if you don't think you have had a satisfactory answer but have the good grace to talk it through first.

 

[JeffD]

I think he came on to find out what a power flush involves

 

[Householder]

Thanks for all the interesting views and helpful advice - very much appreciated.

 

[tamz]

Thanks for all the interesting views and helpful advice - very much appreciated.

Except the comment from Chris Watkins who came in late and shouldn't have bothered postulating b*****ks from his high horse.

I'm afraid i side with Chris. You employed the "contractor" so get the answers and explanations from him which i believe from your last sentence you have to your satisfaction.

 

[JeffD]

A filter on a machine would be magnets as the way to remove sludge, people call it black sludge,it's iron oxide which obviously sticks to magnetic filters, so if your sure then jobs a good one.

 

[Householder]

Thanks JeffD

 

[tamz]

What do you imagine or believe from your research on the internet, a powerflush will actually do for your system?

 

[Householder]

Thanks

 

[Householder]

What do you imagine or believe from your research on the internet, a powerflush will actually do for your system?

You'll get your answer if you watch the Fernox PowerFlushing video on YouTube.

 

[tamz]

You'll get your answer if you watch the Fernox PowerFlushing video on YouTube.

And you believe everything that is sold (yes believe it or not they are selling their product). Btw Fernox promote themselves and their products as environmentally friendly. No good stuff (ie anything that really works) in their wares :wink:

Sorry, but you need to be properly informed to be able to ask pertinent questions. And I've found that it's always healthy to get a second opinion, especially when you dealing with unfamiliar and technical issues.

Thats what you are paying for. A properly informed good service. At the end of the day, you hired a contractor you have no faith in. Maybe you choose wrong. You now live with the decision.

The internet can be your best friend or worst enemy for second opinions. Google some pain or ailment you may be having and start counting down your days.

 

[lame plumber]

householder, the one on his high horse imho, please god dont ever let me work for you, I'd probably end up giving you a glasgow kiss as I left.

 

[Householder]

Thanks

 

[lame plumber]

Don't worry lame plumber, you'd never get granted the job!

there is a god afterall, your problem is that a little knowledge is dangerous and your limited knowledge is obvious. Before you carry on, my experience of large million pound contracts is quite large as I have been a bursar / facilities manager in several large schools and run the projects there and if I was to do what you do to the tradesmen we employed I'd have been in severe trouble with getting any of the projects finished in time. If your unhappy with a tradesman, you in your vast experience should have known what to do immediately you were worried about his ability to do the job. You stop them straightaway, inform them of your worries and if you dont get a satisfactory answer, they are off the job now. why are you asking questions on this site, if with your vast experience you didnt follow the first basic rule of project management,or is it as I would suspect that you are a micromanager who doesnt let people do their work without interfering and wonders why they sometimes just up and off as soon as they can.

 

[Dotty]

Thanks for all the interesting views and helpful advice - very much appreciated.

Glad you had the foresight to edit that as there was nothing insulting in Chris's post that merited your original response.

 

[SimonG]

Well, this one went downhill. Chris and Tamz are correct, you've employed a professional ask him. I've been doing an install all week and spent loads of time answering questions. When I do estimates I answer questions. Existing customers can pick up the phone and ask questions. They all get answers.

It's not a case of paying peanuts is it?

 

[chris watkins]

Thanks

What's with the habit of posting something & then editing in the small hours, can't stand by what you first typed?
Can I thank you for your kind words & helpful advice on my earlier post, I will remember that.
Still does not alter the fact that you are hurt by the truth & proved my point, you are just looking for ammunition against the contractor, please don't let us know how much you managed to get them to take off the quoted cost.

 

[leethegasman]

Send a water sample to fernox for a system health check at a small cost, They will send you a report you will then know the condition of your system,you can then talk to your installer thanking him for a job well done and recommended him or if the report is not good talk to your installer to resolve it,