Dickspanner - Project France

[dickspanner]

OK, I have been a memeber for a while on this forum and return every now and again asking a few questions.

I felt I needed to learn more about plumbing so went and did a C&G in plumbing and I am now qualified.

I have a rather large project which I am undertaking myself (prob rather foolishly but we shall see how it unfolds)

I have a place in france and I am now going to install all the heating system in the house. I have around 70msq which is going to be UFH and resy of house will be rads (15 No.).

I have spoken to a UFH supplier and managed to get a price for all the pipe, clips and manifold. I am installing UFH on Kingspan panels and using 4sand1cement screed hand mixed with limited water content to allow it to dry over a period of weeks (as I will retun home while is is going hard etc). Manifold in basement.

That is an easy but time consuming part. (each room to have a thermastat installed for control later)

I am installing 15 rads with thermastst except 2 perm on rads), all with plastic pipework down to distribution manifold in Basement. Again easy part.

I have chosen to install two Hurcules 30b log burners for a heat source and Navitron solar for the other heat source.

So this is where questions begin.

The back boiler from the log burner has 1 1/2 BSP fittings (4 no), 2 of which will be capped and the two will be plumbed down to basement, my thoughts are I should keep this diameter to the basement as one fire is about a 10m run to manifold in basement and other is about 3. I was thinking that these should be pumped seperatly and pumps switched via thermastatic swith near boiler. Flow from pumps joined to go so heat store. (Very unlikely both would be running at same time).

Supply of heated water goes into bufer tank via heat exchanger????

Heating comes via heat exchanger from buffer tank.

Am I thinking in the right area here or is this specialist stuff or stuff off the shelf.

I think this may create a massive lag between log burner being on and heat being provided to rads and uderfloor heating?

Is there a way that the water in the backboiler circuits can be directly connected to heating circuits eg rads and underfloor heating.

Dickspanner

 

[Howsie]

Its a big project for your first and probably a little much to cover in a forum post. Why don't you employ the services of a plumber and work with him and learn at the same time? Probably work out cheaper (and less stressful) in the end...

 

[PlumbBobBob]

i agree, there are so many things that can go wrong with a system like this that it would be a good idea to get a plumber with more experience to help in this instance.

 

[dickspanner]

Sorry made this sound like the first thing I had done since qualifying, its not, I have done lots of other plumbing since qualifying this isn't my first job, In this house I have plumbed hot and cold through the house including kitchen and three bathrooms so I am not too over faced at the moment and like said I am happy to get all rads down to distibution manifold on wall in basement and happy to do all 6 floor zones down to a distribution manifold in basement.

Installing log burners is not a problems but the first thing I was thinking is the back boiler has 1 1/2 BSP fittings on the rear and should I realistically plumb the water from both these back boilers down to the basement in mild steel with boss white etc at the same diameter or should I take it down to a smaller diameter or change bore and material to copper being such a distance run.

So when all three phases are in I will have two distribution manifolds and a heat source. I have already plumbed the service riser from the roof zone (just under roof tiles) to the area of the room where the buffer tank will be located. This will connect the solar panels to the heat exchanger in the buffer tank.

Dickspanner

 

[WHPES]

If you're asking such questions its a sure indication that you really need to leave it to somebody who knows what the are doing, or if you want to do the work you should at least get an experienced person to design the system which you can then install yourself. A C&G course is nowhere near enough knowledge and experience for undertaking such an installation. Getting it wrong could leave you with a system that doesnt work properly, or at worst, dangerous.

 

[dickspanner]

Ok.

I hear what you are saying in relation to getting advice.

The system is fully designed out, however in my industry the hardest part is design co-ordination between various suppliers products.

When you specify one particular product to undertake a task, for example the solar syatem, as soon as it goes outside the items they supply there is no assistance or desire to underwrite designs. I found this when I designed the underfloor heating system in my house in the UK powered by a combi boiler. The system was suplied by three seperate companies and not one would state the overall design would work (Which is understandable). So I had to progress on my own design and the system works fine still 7yrs in.

I have already had the design reviewed by a ECI engineer and Mechanical and thermal dynamics engineer however when you talk about designs they have not seen before they can only comment on schemes rather than nut and bolt design.

I will go back to suppliers of products and try and get the information I require from the technical departments and hopefully be able to finalise areas where no inforamtion is cuurently available.

Thank you for advice.

Dickspanner.