Mains frozen - in a panic

[cronos]

Hi,
After discovering there was no mains water this morning, I've traced the problem part of the way. Looks like the blue plastic mains is frozen somewhere between the street mains and the stopcock under my sink. I've tried gently warming the 6 inches or so of the blue mains that I have access to - after that its under the floorboards. Set up a fan heater in that cupboard for a couple of hours today in the hope of getting some thawing - no joy. Also checked out the 2 feet or so of copper pipes to the sink but I'm 99% sure the blockage is in my crawlspace or garden.

I have a closed CH system so that still works, as does my hot water to the taps - with one exception.
The hot water to my sink is also off - I've traced that back and it goes under the floor at the same spot as the mains enters. My theory is that both pipes have frozen at the same spot - under the floor around the kitchen sink.

To add to the problem theres no hot or cold water to the downstairs cloakroom at the front of the house - they split from the hot and cold (mains) in the cupboard under the kitchen sink and disappear under the floor at the same spot as the blue mains.

Steps I've taken so far are:
- turned off mains at stopcock
- spoken to British Gas about my HomeCare agreement, although their stance was they only do burst pipes, not frozen (I see their point) - in any case they dont cover the mains
- thought about looking for the mains cock in the street to turn that off, but been put off by the 2 feet of snow covering the whole garden and pavement
- not using hot water taps at all to keep the water thats there for the CH
- using absolute minimum of cold water from tank for washing etc
- considered phoning Scottish Water to point out that even though the frozen pipe is likely on my property, if it bursts they'll be losing a lot of water.....

Been thinking as to why this has happened. House is reasonably new (10 years), in good condition, well maintained, heating hasnt been off for over a week now. It was bitterly cold today and Monday night (it was -14c at 3pm today), but it was a lot cold than that last winter.

Any hints, tips or advice would be greatly appreciated.
Cheers

 

[tamz]

There is no need to be in a panic YET Not all frozen pipes burst.

"considered phoning Scottish Water to point out that even though the frozen pipe is likely on my property, if it bursts they'll be losing a lot of water"
Come on, is this a serious statement?

In the meantime leave your frozen taps open a bit while you are around. It may free itself and if it does let it run through for a wee while.
Turn your stopcock off when you go to bed and ring a local plumber in the morning.

Btw it is the draught and the cold wind that freezes pipes more than the temp so look for pipes near a vent.

 

[tackleburger]

I've hads three calls today about the same thing including my mother. There is sod all you can do unless you can absotutely identify the frozen part. If not you just have to sit it out and like Tamz says leave a tap open when you are around. May be wise to turn off at night and if you are out but won't make much difference to outcome if you do get a burst under floor unless you get to the toby.

 

[dontknowitall]

Yet another frozen pipe call out today. Wish they all went like today's job. Just about to stop for my nose bag at lunch time. Phone from customer about 20 minutes away. Said I'd be 1/2 hour or so (after din dins). Called round. Fended off three alsations. Quick chat to his mother.

Was shown pipework of house (for once someone knew sort of what was what). Up ladder to loft (ladder all ready for me). Felt pipe. Tried my hands for a few minutes while chatting to customer. Waited for drips from ball valve. More chatting. Few drips. Asked for hair dryer. He couldn't find it. Went to get blow torch.

Melted pipes and water flowed. Checked ball valve operation - perfect. Checked for pipe leaks - none. Gave simple advice on how to avoid problems in future.

One hour. Asked for £45. Given £50 in cash. And will return to do a day's work when I'm quieter.

 

[royston]

Had alot of bursts over the last 2 days from outside taps, wash basin and kitchen sink wastes, and tonight a hot and cold pipe that had both frozen in a kitchen boxing ! Not complaining though and hope the frost lasts a while yet !!

 

[GQuigley67]

so what are the best ways to resolve frozen pipes ?

 

[royston]

the ones ive been defrosting that havent burst like waste pipes, ive just poured boiling water over them.

 

[PlumbBobBob]

lagging.

 

[royston]

Dont have runs of mains pipework outside when having outside taps fitted, even when lagged they are still freezing. Same in garages to.

 

[GQuigley67]

well i mean pipes that are frozen, heat them with your gas bottle ? I have a friend whos pipes are frozen and I would like to know how to fix it for her as she has no heating or water.

 

[Dannypipe]

Hair dryer, or wrap warm a hot towel around the pipe...if possible boil a kettle and pour that over the afflicted area. Remember to leave the taps cracked open to let a flow as this will aid the defrost and prevent a build up of pressure.

You can use a blow torch, but obviously this can cause the water in the pipe to boil, and without a flow, you get a build up of pressure in the pipe, so it's best avoided unless you know what you're doing....which you probably do. Basically you don't want to get the pipe too hot with the blow torch! So definetly not to be done by a DIYer, who must stick to the hairdryer/kettle method.

Then once it's done, get it lagged to prevent it refreezing. Do this ASAP as I learnt in my earlier years, you could get a call the next morning saying its frozen again!! If you can't lag it that same day, leave it running just a trickle and this will prevent a ice plug forming. Not a long term solution though obviously!

 

[GQuigley67]

thanks mate, yeh well i would be gentle with the gas bottle i wouldn't be heating it until its glowing red lol, i think the gas bottle would probably be the fastest way to do it with a tap open, as for pouring the boiling water over the affected area, wouldn't that just cause a mess ?

and as for plastic pipe etc, i would probably use the hair dryer, hot water bottle treatment.

 

[Dannypipe]

Yeah, you just have to be real carefull with a blow torch as you're just melting an ice block, not sweating a joint, I keep the flame way back, and keep it on the move. Then I feel the pipe, I don't want it to feel hot, just tepid, you know the ice has started to melt once it's above freezing so why blast the hell out of it and split the pipe....and get showered in boiling water!

Sure you'll be fine mate.

 

[GQuigley67]

well what you just said is what i would of done, as i know how hot the flames are on the torches. But thanks anyway

 

[bm1289]

Heating pipes with blow torch could fracture pipes if care not takin. Best to set up small heater,or pour hot water over pipes to let them thaw gradually!
Also open water outlet to allow expansion.

 

[dontknowitall]

Hair dryer around the flammable parts (e.g. cisterns which can melt or lagging or loft insulation) and blow torch where it's safe.

I go carefully. It the ball valve starts dripping I listen for hissing noises as there might be a burst pipe somewhere. Also feel all round the pipes to make sure they're nice and smooth. If it's burst (and still iced up) there will be a bump with a cut in it.

I'm not sure there's any really "safe" method - 9 times out of 10 there's just ice in the pipe and nothing has expanded to cause a leak. I just prefer to take a little time and go carefully. A bit like fitting new pipework and turning the stop tap on. I turn it a little and see what happens rather than on full and rushing around to turn it off again then spend 1/2 hour clearing up the mess.

 

[GQuigley67]

had to go fix one today for my mates grandad, the pipe came out of the soldered 90 degree bend, i don't know how old this pipework was but it was as if you wer doing an air pressure test and the joint wasn't soldered.

 

[dontknowitall]

Grrr - another frozen pipe and the floor was wet. Hacked the plasterwork away to dig. No leak. Still a noise. Bloomin' water crossed 4m of floor from a frozen pipe the other side of the room. Turned off the isolation valve for the outside tap. All fixed (apart from the wrecked plaster).

Trouble is it's MY house