How to add Sentinel cleaner to system?

[ben100]

I need to add some Sentinel cleaner to my system, I have a combi boiler. I know I have to add it to a radiator, can this be any radiator & when emptying the radiator do I empty until there's no more water coming out from the valve at the bottom? Do I have to bleed any other rads? I would just like to know any details like that or any that I haven't said so I don't miss anything, a sort of step by step guide?

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Are you having problems with sludge / the reason why you think it might need a clean ?

 

[steadyon]

Assuming you do need to add it:
1. It doesn't have to be via a radiator.
2. Add it with the system turned off.
3. If you have a filter like a Magnaclean near the boiler, you can add it via that. Turn off the valves on the inlet to and outlet from the filter, remove the lid, siphon / sponge out the water and pour in the Sentinel. Turn the valves on and run the system for 10 minutes. Probably repeat because you can't get a whole litre in the first time. Not all filters have removable lids.
4. If you have a towel rail / radiator on the system you can add it via that. Close both valves at the base of the radiator. Undo the bleed nipple, and bleed until no more water comes out. Undo the big nut with the bleed nipple in the middle of it, and remove. Syphon as much water as you can out of the radiator, and add the Sentinel. Replace the big nut and bleed nipple, make sure bleed nipple is closed, open valves and run the system.
5. If you have to do it through a radiator, the principle and practice is the same as for a towel rail, but its generally a bit more awkward. Also, there may be no "big nut" on the top of the radiator, particularly if old.
6. If you are using X400 you can get the chemical in a "rapid dose" container. You still have to release system pressure (e.g. via a bleed nipple) but then just follow the instructions. I have never personally found these much use, but its probably me.
7. However you do it, it is worth bleeding all the radiators when the system has gone cold, and bringing the boiler pressure back up to its usual value (around 1.3 bar) as necessary.
8. When you have finished flushing the system, you will need to drain it entirely. How long it stays in depends on what cleaner you are using. Once flushed and drained, refill with clean water and add an inhibitor.

 

[ben100000000]

Are you having problems with sludge / the reason why you think it might need a clean ?

Yes I am & was told to add this to the system.

 

[ben100]

Assuming you do need to add it:
1. It doesn't have to be via a radiator.
2. Add it with the system turned off.
3. If you have a filter like a Magnaclean near the boiler, you can add it via that. Turn off the valves on the inlet to and outlet from the filter, remove the lid, siphon / sponge out the water and pour in the Sentinel. Turn the valves on and run the system for 10 minutes. Probably repeat because you can't get a whole litre in the first time. Not all filters have removable lids.
4. If you have a towel rail / radiator on the system you can add it via that. Close both valves at the base of the radiator. Undo the bleed nipple, and bleed until no more water comes out. Undo the big nut with the bleed nipple in the middle of it, and remove. Syphon as much water as you can out of the radiator, and add the Sentinel. Replace the big nut and bleed nipple, make sure bleed nipple is closed, open valves and run the system.
5. If you have to do it through a radiator, the principle and practice is the same as for a towel rail, but its generally a bit more awkward. Also, there may be no "big nut" on the top of the radiator, particularly if old.
6. If you are using X400 you can get the chemical in a "rapid dose" container. You still have to release system pressure (e.g. via a bleed nipple) but then just follow the instructions. I have never personally found these much use, but its probably me.
7. However you do it, it is worth bleeding all the radiators when the system has gone cold, and bringing the boiler pressure back up to its usual value (around 1.3 bar) as necessary.
8. When you have finished flushing the system, you will need to drain it entirely. How long it stays in depends on what cleaner you are using. Once flushed and drained, refill with clean water and add an inhibitor.

Ok so I will add it through the towel rad. I will syphon the water out with a hose from the nut at the top so would I still need to bleed water out of the nipple as you've said if I'm removing water out with hose anyway? Do I just remove enough water to add the Sentinel or completely empty the rad as I will be adding 2 of the Sentinel bottles because I have a total of 16 rads in the house?

To your point no 7, do you mean to bleed the rads after I've added the Sentinel or before & you just mean bleed the air that's it not any water out is that correct?

Also at the bottom of the towel rad I have one valve that is a + - & the other side is one of those lockshield valves with a plastic cap on top of it, do I need to do anything to the lockshield valve?

 

[steadyon]

1. Yes, relieve the system pressure via the bleed nipple before removing the big nut.
2. Empty 2 litres out if you are putting 2 litres in.
3. Bleed the system after you've added the Sentinel. Bleeding means removing the air.
4. You will have to shut both radiator valves, or you will have a flood. For the lock shield, count the number of 1/8 turns required to close it completely. When re-opening, re-open by the same number of 1/8 turns to maintain the system's balance.

 

[ben100]

1. Yes, relieve the system pressure via the bleed nipple before removing the big nut.
2. Empty 2 litres out if you are putting 2 litres in.
3. Bleed the system after you've added the Sentinel. Bleeding means removing the air.
4. You will have to shut both radiator valves, or you will have a flood. For the lock shield, count the number of 1/8 turns required to close it completely. When re-opening, re-open by the same number of 1/8 turns to maintain the system's balance.

Ok last one so is it ok to close the bleed valve back off once the air is out before removing the big nut or do I have to leave that open as there's no air just water coming out now?

 

[steadyon]

1. When you need to relieve the pressure within the system:
1a. Leave both radiator valves open.
1b. Open the bleed nipple.
1c. Let any air in the radiator out.
1d. Let any water which comes out under pressure come out. This will reduce the pressure in the system to zero (well, atmospheric pressure).
1e. Close the bleed nipple.
1f. Close both radiator valves, allowing for point 4 in my previous post.
1g. Remove the big nut.
1h. Syphon out 2 litres of water, add 2 litres of Sentinel.
1i. Replace big nut and make sure bleed nipple is tight.
1j. Open both radiator valves.
1k. Re-pressurise system as necessary via. filling loop.
1l. Run system for appropriate time.
2. Then as previously advised.

 

[ben100]

1. When you need to relieve the pressure within the system:
1a. Leave both radiator valves open.
1b. Open the bleed nipple.
1c. Let any air in the radiator out.
1d. Let any water which comes out under pressure come out. This will reduce the pressure in the system to zero (well, atmospheric pressure).
1e. Close the bleed nipple.
1f. Close both radiator valves, allowing for point 4 in my previous post.
1g. Remove the big nut.
1h. Syphon out 2 litres of water, add 2 litres of Sentinel.
1i. Replace big nut and make sure bleed nipple is tight.
1j. Open both radiator valves.
1k. Re-pressurise system as necessary via. filling loop.
1l. Run system for appropriate time.
2. Then as previously advised.

So I've added the Sentinel X400 & it's been in the system for a couple weeks now & I'm looking to drain it out soon. How exactly is this done? I know roughly what to do but just want to make sure I don't miss anything.

 

[steadyon]

1. Turn off boiler. Make sure all radiator valves are at least partly open, but don't touch the lockshields unless you really have to.
2. Relieve system pressure via a radiator bleed valve. Close bleed valve afterwards.
3. Locate lowest drain off point. This may be a radiator valve or valves with a drain off built in, or one or more drain cocks (see Screwfix 12232 to see what it looks like). Drain cocks my be internal, or if you are very lucky outside at ground floor level. Push hose pipe over open end of drain cock and run other end outside / to drain. End of hose must be lower than drain cock, and hose should not rise between ends. I usually put a jubilee clip over the hose at drain cock end, and plenty of old towels on floor beneath. Open drain cock.
4. If there is no drain cock, you can drain from a convenient (ground floor, near door or drain) radiator:
4a. Turn off both radiator valves, counting lockshield 1/8 turns as previously.
4b. Get ready with some shallow dishes and old towels.
4c. Undo the compression nuts holding the valves to the radiator tails and empty contents of radiator into dishes / towels. Water could be very dirty, so steer clear of carpets etc.
4d. Very slightly slacken the compression nut holding the incoming pipe to one of the valves.
4e. Pull valve off radiator tail and turn 90 degree to face you. Re-tighten compression nut holding valve to pipe.
4f. Attach hose pipe to open face of valve using lots of insulating tape. Make sure it is reasonably secure.
4g. Loads of old towels underneath.
4h. Open valve and system will start to drain.
5. As you have a combi you will have no motorised valves to worry about, but if wasn't a combi you would need to manually open them.
6. Starting upstairs, go round the radiators opening the bleed valves. As each is opened you may hear the hiss of air being drawn in. If water comes out, shut valve and wait a few moments until the system has drained a bit more.
7. Once water has stopped flowing from the hose, the system is drained.
8. If it were me I'd flush the system through with clean water a couple of times:
8a. Make sure all radiator bleed valves are closed.
8b. If you had no drain cock and did as 4 above, I'd reattach the valves to that radiator rather than risk the makeshift joint coming apart. Then fill and re-drain as above. Maybe a couple of times.
8c. If you have a drain cock, just close it.
8d. Refill the system, opening the bleed valve on each radiator (from bottom up) to make sure the radiator is full of water.
8e. Make sure that the boiler pressure doesn't go over 1.5 bar while doing this. Best to let some water in, shut off the inlet valve, bleed the radiators until pressure drops, open inlet valve and repeat.
9. After final drain, refill adding inhibitor as you did for adding cleaner.

 

[king of pipes]

1. Turn off boiler. Make sure all radiator valves are at least partly open, but don't touch the lockshields unless you really have to.
2. Relieve system pressure via a radiator bleed valve. Close bleed valve afterwards.
3. Locate lowest drain off point. This may be a radiator valve or valves with a drain off built in, or one or more drain cocks (see Screwfix 12232 to see what it looks like). Drain cocks my be internal, or if you are very lucky outside at ground floor level. Push hose pipe over open end of drain cock and run other end outside / to drain. End of hose must be lower than drain cock, and hose should not rise between ends. I usually put a jubilee clip over the hose at drain cock end, and plenty of old towels on floor beneath. Open drain cock.
4. If there is no drain cock, you can drain from a convenient (ground floor, near door or drain) radiator:
4a. Turn off both radiator valves, counting lockshield 1/8 turns as previously.
4b. Get ready with some shallow dishes and old towels.
4c. Undo the compression nuts holding the valves to the radiator tails and empty contents of radiator into dishes / towels. Water could be very dirty, so steer clear of carpets etc.
4d. Very slightly slacken the compression nut holding the incoming pipe to one of the valves.
4e. Pull valve off radiator tail and turn 90 degree to face you. Re-tighten compression nut holding valve to pipe.
4f. Attach hose pipe to open face of valve using lots of insulating tape. Make sure it is reasonably secure.
4g. Loads of old towels underneath.
4h. Open valve and system will start to drain.
5. As you have a combi you will have no motorised valves to worry about, but if wasn't a combi you would need to manually open them.
6. Starting upstairs, go round the radiators opening the bleed valves. As each is opened you may hear the hiss of air being drawn in. If water comes out, shut valve and wait a few moments until the system has drained a bit more.
7. Once water has stopped flowing from the hose, the system is drained.
8. If it were me I'd flush the system through with clean water a couple of times:
8a. Make sure all radiator bleed valves are closed.
8b. If you had no drain cock and did as 4 above, I'd reattach the valves to that radiator rather than risk the makeshift joint coming apart. Then fill and re-drain as above. Maybe a couple of times.
8c. If you have a drain cock, just close it.
8d. Refill the system, opening the bleed valve on each radiator (from bottom up) to make sure the radiator is full of water.
8e. Make sure that the boiler pressure doesn't go over 1.5 bar while doing this. Best to let some water in, shut off the inlet valve, bleed the radiators until pressure drops, open inlet valve and repeat.
9. After final drain, refill adding inhibitor as you did for adding cleaner.

And breath

 

[ben100]

1. Turn off boiler. Make sure all radiator valves are at least partly open, but don't touch the lockshields unless you really have to.
2. Relieve system pressure via a radiator bleed valve. Close bleed valve afterwards.
3. Locate lowest drain off point. This may be a radiator valve or valves with a drain off built in, or one or more drain cocks (see Screwfix 12232 to see what it looks like). Drain cocks my be internal, or if you are very lucky outside at ground floor level. Push hose pipe over open end of drain cock and run other end outside / to drain. End of hose must be lower than drain cock, and hose should not rise between ends. I usually put a jubilee clip over the hose at drain cock end, and plenty of old towels on floor beneath. Open drain cock.
4. If there is no drain cock, you can drain from a convenient (ground floor, near door or drain) radiator:
4a. Turn off both radiator valves, counting lockshield 1/8 turns as previously.
4b. Get ready with some shallow dishes and old towels.
4c. Undo the compression nuts holding the valves to the radiator tails and empty contents of radiator into dishes / towels. Water could be very dirty, so steer clear of carpets etc.
4d. Very slightly slacken the compression nut holding the incoming pipe to one of the valves.
4e. Pull valve off radiator tail and turn 90 degree to face you. Re-tighten compression nut holding valve to pipe.
4f. Attach hose pipe to open face of valve using lots of insulating tape. Make sure it is reasonably secure.
4g. Loads of old towels underneath.
4h. Open valve and system will start to drain.
5. As you have a combi you will have no motorised valves to worry about, but if wasn't a combi you would need to manually open them.
6. Starting upstairs, go round the radiators opening the bleed valves. As each is opened you may hear the hiss of air being drawn in. If water comes out, shut valve and wait a few moments until the system has drained a bit more.
7. Once water has stopped flowing from the hose, the system is drained.
8. If it were me I'd flush the system through with clean water a couple of times:
8a. Make sure all radiator bleed valves are closed.
8b. If you had no drain cock and did as 4 above, I'd reattach the valves to that radiator rather than risk the makeshift joint coming apart. Then fill and re-drain as above. Maybe a couple of times.
8c. If you have a drain cock, just close it.
8d. Refill the system, opening the bleed valve on each radiator (from bottom up) to make sure the radiator is full of water.
8e. Make sure that the boiler pressure doesn't go over 1.5 bar while doing this. Best to let some water in, shut off the inlet valve, bleed the radiators until pressure drops, open inlet valve and repeat.
9. After final drain, refill adding inhibitor as you did for adding cleaner.

When adding the inhibitor which I will do through the towel rad again when the system is drained completely, would I still have to turn the valve & the lockshield valve off before removing the nut at the top even though the system will be empty? Also I will open the upstairs bleed valves when doing the draining do I need to open any downstairs?

 

[steadyon]

1. If you add the inhibitor will the system is empty there is no need to touch the valves on the towel radiator.
2. Re. radiator bleed valves. When draining, relieve pressure, start draining. As you drain open the bleed valves, starting with the physically highest bleed point on the system. As the system drains down, open the lower ones, including the ground floor. Just be careful. If you open a downstairs one while an upstairs radiator still has water in it, water will come out of the bleed point, rather than air going in.

 

[ben100]

1. If you add the inhibitor will the system is empty there is no need to touch the valves on the towel radiator.
2. Re. radiator bleed valves. When draining, relieve pressure, start draining. As you drain open the bleed valves, starting with the physically highest bleed point on the system. As the system drains down, open the lower ones, including the ground floor. Just be careful. If you open a downstairs one while an upstairs radiator still has water in it, water will come out of the bleed point, rather than air going in.

So I'm draining the system & have filled again & will do it a few more times. When draining down there are two radiators downstairs on each side of a wall (one on one side in a room & in the same sort of area on the other side of the wall in the other room) that just keep water in them even when the hose has stopped flowing. All other rads have the air going in just these two keep having water come out no matter how long I wait, any ideas?

 

[king of pipes]

They are fed from above on dropped pipework so the heating water cannot drain unless there's a a drain point fitted to these radiators ?

 

[ben100]

They are fed from above on dropped pipework so the heating water cannot drain unless there's a a drain point fitted to these radiators ?

Sorry yes posted that before I noticed the drain cock on one of them all good now. Also how many times do I need to keep draining & filling I’ve done it twice now & the water is not that dirty?

 

[king of pipes]

I would say that's enough usually its a hot flush and then a cold flush before refilling and adding the inhibitor. Regards kop