Calculating shower waste pipe fall

[GerryB]

Simple questions, I hope:

When planning the run of the waste pipe from a new shower, do I calculate the fall from the shower tray surface or from the shower trap outlet?

I'm working on a required fall with 40mm pipe of 18mm per 1m and I have a 2m straight span to cross. Is this correct?

 

[snowhead]

Outlet.
The fall from the tray through the trap is vertical.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

15mm a meter

So around 30mm for 2m

 

[Rob Foster]

Shaun is dead right, too much fall leaves debris behind as the outflow goes to fast. However
in my experience an almost level waste will get stuff away if it ends up with a good drop at the end maybe up to 2/3 m even with a bend
Rob Foster aka centralheatking
its not regulations but practical experience working on old buildings
in Bath etc

 

[chris watkins]

As above, Rob is right & this is where experience wins out every time.
Knowing what it should be according to the Regs against what you can get away with if required.
We know the 18 - 90mm per Metre in Part H was arrived at when copper & cast iron or even lead was still being used, S/W plastic has a much smoother bore (as long as it is de-burred) so can be laid at much shallower falls especially over sort distances.

Now you can wait half a life time to acquire this kind of knowledge or it can be passed on to an apprentice, which is why I believe in the system so passionately.
What were you told Rob "give it a turn of a bubble" ?

 

[chris watkins]

The tool of choice !!

Monument de-burring tool about £4.00

 

[Harvest Fields]

View attachment 39410The tool of choice !!

Aaaagghhh but what is it?

 

[Andy-36]

As above, Rob is right & this is where experience wins out every time.
Knowing what it should be according to the Regs against what you can get away with if required.
We know the 18 - 90mm per Metre in Part H was arrived at when copper & cast iron or even lead was still being used, S/W plastic has a much smoother bore (as long as it is de-burred) so can be laid at much shallower falls especially over sort distances.

Now you can wait half a life time to acquire this kind of knowledge or it can be passed on to an apprentice, which is why I believe in the system so passionately.
What were you told Rob "give it a turn of a bubble" ?

Wish more people had the same thought process about apprentices. I'm currently trying to find an apprenticeship with little / no luck. Only 38 companys / traders spoken to, the search continues.

 

[Rob Foster]

Look I was really lucky in the early 80,s combis came in and the old fellas could not convert from vented etc. so I swapped my new knowledge for their old
and valued experience. So I can join lead, make snow boxes etc because these fellas shared their knowhow with me then in the late 90,s I picked up a cohort of ex Cammel Laird fitters ..the ones who built submarines etc who also knew loads more than me and were chucked onto the scrap heap aged 50 ..but needed organising into a new business..and we did well..
so I have never been an apprentice. Then Mike and I started Api 2006..to my mind there is little to stop an inteligent young person
setting up as a plumber and any problems ask us on UKPF
Rob Foster aka centralheatking

 

[chris watkins]

Wish more people had the same thought process about apprentices. I'm currently trying to find an apprenticeship with little / no luck. Only 38 companys / traders spoken to, the search continues.

Best of luck Andy please keep on, it is the best way to learn the trade.

I feel for you with little or know support from government or industry & a newly changing qualification which will in effect prevent 100's if not 1000's, working on large buildings developments from gaining the recognised qualification it is a tough time to be trying to join & plug the skills gap.

 

[Rob Foster]

Wish more people had the same thought process about apprentices. I'm currently trying to find an apprenticeship with little / no luck. Only 38 companys / traders spoken to, the search continues.

Ok It all depends on where you are...it is possible that we on UKPF might be able to help you
centralheatking

 

[Aire]

Wish more people had the same thought process about apprentices. I'm currently trying to find an apprenticeship with little / no luck. Only 38 companys / traders spoken to, the search continues.

Keep trying, took me two years to get my apprenticeship, countless letter and even offering my services for free got me no where. Some companies aren't interested and others already have apprentices. Keep sending letters every few months to the same companies. If they've got an apprentice who they've let go due to poor interest, your repeated attempted should help you fill their place.

 

[Andy-36]

Look I was really lucky in the early 80,s combis came in and the old fellas could not convert from vented etc. so I swapped my new knowledge for their old
and valued experience. So I can join lead, make snow boxes etc because these fellas shared their knowhow with me then in the late 90,s I picked up a cohort of ex Cammel Laird fitters ..the ones who built submarines etc who also knew loads more than me and were chucked onto the scrap heap aged 50 ..but needed organising into a new business..and we did well..
so I have never been an apprentice. Then Mike and I started Api 2006..to my mind there is little to stop an inteligent young person
setting up as a plumber and any problems ask us on UKPF
Rob Foster aka centralheatking

Yeah I understand what you're saying but as I've said a few times to plumbers I've spoken to you can learn at college and you can read books but nothing beats learning from someone with years of experience, the knowledge you gain from real people is worth its weight in gold.

Best of luck Andy please keep on, it is the best way to learn the trade.

I feel for you with little or know support from government or industry & a newly changing qualification which will in effect prevent 100's if not 1000's, working on large buildings developments from gaining the recognised qualification it is a tough time to be trying to join & plug the skills gap.

Thanks, I can only keep going and trying after all it wont come knocking at my door if I don't.

Ok It all depends on where you are...it is possible that we on UKPF might be able to help you
centralheatking

I'm West Oxfordshire. Carterton area.

Keep trying, took me two years to get my apprenticeship, countless letter and even offering my services for free got me no where. Some companies aren't interested and others already have apprentices. Keep sending letters every few months to the same companies. If they've got an apprentice who they've let go due to poor interest, your repeated attempted should help you fill their place.

I've not sent random letters to be honest. I've picked up the phone and spoken to people and if they are interested I send CV / cover letter. As I say my list is around 38 companies now, when I get to around 50 I might start banging my head against the wall.

I've spoken to some really decent blokes who have been more than willing to offer advice on how to get an apprenticeship but sadly nothing has worked as yet. Visited plumbing merchants, Visited the training centre, Phoned people, Put a poster up in the local training centre. A few more phone calls to make tomorrow to a few more companies. Just need that foot in the door as they say..

 

[rpm]

Aaaagghhh but what is it?

You are joking right? I mean C`mon read it again.

 

[Harvest Fields]

You are joking right? I mean C`mon read it again.

You are joking right? I mean C`mon read it again.

I do know what it is mate, I have one. But he added the description and price in afterwards. It was just a picture to begin with

 

[Rob Foster]

Yeah I understand what you're saying but as I've said a few times to plumbers I've spoken to you can learn at college and you can read books but nothing beats learning from someone with years of experience, the knowledge you gain from real people is worth its weight in gold.



Thanks, I can only keep going and trying after all it wont come knocking at my door if I don't.



I'm West Oxfordshire. Carterton area.



I've not sent random letters to be honest. I've picked up the phone and spoken to people and if they are interested I send CV / cover letter. As I say my list is around 38 companies now, when I get to around 50 I might start banging my head against the wall.

I've spoken to some really decent blokes who have been more than willing to offer advice on how to get an apprenticeship but sadly nothing has worked as yet. Visited plumbing merchants, Visited the training centre, Phoned people, Put a poster up in the local training centre. A few more phone calls to make tomorrow to a few more companies. Just need that foot in the door as they say..

I know its a bit off the wall but look at Network Rail and all the companies engaged in HS2 they are in your area and really want new blood for this project which will go on for years , I think Balfour Beatty, and Babcock might also be a good set of contacts...instead of thinking small ...GO BIG...and what about the new nuke plant at Hinckley Point ...there are 4000 fellas on that job
Rob Foster

 

[rpm]

edit

 

[Harvest Fields]

Doesn`t show as an edit but ho hum whatever.

That’s ok.

 

[rpm]

Mine doesn`t show as an edit either, perhaps that`s been dropped

 

[Harvest Fields]

Mine doesn`t show as an edit either, perhaps that`s been dropped

It was edited literally straight after my response mate.

 

[chris watkins]

I do know what it is mate, I have one. But he added the description and price in afterwards. It was just a picture to begin with

Yes sorry about that, you were right I should have added a description for the hard of thinking but the price was always there, the price is always there.

 

[chris watkins]

sorry RPM

 

[chris watkins]

sorry RPM

didn't mean it, just didn't want to get banded for a month LOL
& always makes me nervous when a mod puts a love hart up for someone !!

 

[Harvest Fields]

didn't mean it, just didn't want to get banded for a month LOL
& always makes me nervous when a mod puts a love hart up for someone !!

I just like it when we all get along

 

[Stigster]

Shaun is dead right, too much fall leaves debris behind as the outflow goes to fast.

If in doubt, pour some standard unleaded, not the high octane stuff, down the drain and set fire to it.

(Don't actually do this, ever!)

 

[Rob Foster]

Yeah I understand what you're saying but as I've said a few times to plumbers I've spoken to you can learn at college and you can read books but nothing beats learning from someone with years of experience, the knowledge you gain from real people is worth its weight in gold.



Thanks, I can only keep going and trying after all it wont come knocking at my door if I don't.



I'm West Oxfordshire. Carterton area.



I've not sent random letters to be honest. I've picked up the phone and spoken to people and if they are interested I send CV / cover letter. As I say my list is around 38 companies now, when I get to around 50 I might start banging my head against the wall.

I've spoken to some really decent blokes who have been more than willing to offer advice on how to get an apprenticeship but sadly nothing has worked as yet. Visited plumbing merchants, Visited the training centre, Phoned people, Put a poster up in the local training centre. A few more phone calls to make tomorrow to a few more companies. Just need that foot in the door as they say..

The biggest asset you can offer will be your own transport and a driving licence that will put well ahead of the others. Then you will be so much more usefull. Rob Foster aka centralheatking

 

[Andy-36]

The biggest asset you can offer will be your own transport and a driving licence that will put well ahead of the others. Then you will be so much more usefull. Rob Foster aka centralheatking

Indeed, I've spoken to a couple of plumbers over the last couple of days who sadly weren't taking anyone on however very useless chats. It does seem that a lot of lads/lady's are put off taking on apprentices due to previous bad experiences which is a shame really.

 

[Rob Foster]

Indeed, I've spoken to a couple of plumbers over the last couple of days who sadly weren't taking anyone on however very useless chats. It does seem that a lot of lads/lady's are put off taking on apprentices due to previous bad experiences which is a shame really.

Centrica are taking on , it gets bad press but its a start in my opinion. centralheatking

 

[Robert Bell]

Yeah I understand what you're saying but as I've said a few times to plumbers I've spoken to you can learn at college and you can read books but nothing beats learning from someone with years of experience, the knowledge you gain from real people is worth its weight in gold.



Thanks, I can only keep going and trying after all it wont come knocking at my door if I don't.



I'm West Oxfordshire. Carterton area.



I've not sent random letters to be honest. I've picked up the phone and spoken to people and if they are interested I send CV / cover letter. As I say my list is around 38 companies now, when I get to around 50 I might start banging my head against the wall.

I've spoken to some really decent blokes who have been more than willing to offer advice on how to get an apprenticeship but sadly nothing has worked as yet. Visited plumbing merchants, Visited the training centre, Phoned people, Put a poster up in the local training centre. A few more phone calls to make tomorrow to a few more companies. Just need that foot in the door as they say..

Look I was really lucky in the early 80,s combis came in and the old fellas could not convert from vented etc. so I swapped my new knowledge for their old
and valued experience. So I can join lead, make snow boxes etc because these fellas shared their knowhow with me then in the late 90,s I picked up a cohort of ex Cammel Laird fitters ..the ones who built submarines etc who also knew loads more than me and were chucked onto the scrap heap aged 50 ..but needed organising into a new business..and we did well..
so I have never been an apprentice. Then Mike and I started Api 2006..to my mind there is little to stop an inteligent young person
setting up as a plumber and any problems ask us on UKPF
Rob Foster aka centralheatking

I had the problem of some lack ing in information as while off work ill I decided to tKe a Plumbing course back in 05. We weren’t told that to continue through the trade we would need to gain work with a plumber to get the NVQ so we could advance to gas. I couldn’t find a plumber willing to take on a 40 year old apprentice at that time. So I ended up going self employed as a general plumber and occasionally I get to work with a well seasoned gas engineer and learn much of the old school tricks and tips from him. Still wish I could get my gas. Was thinking of doing my G3 as starting to see them more around here these days.

 

[Welder]

I had the problem of some lack ing in information as while off work ill I decided to tKe a Plumbing course back in 05. We weren’t told that to continue through the trade we would need to gain work with a plumber to get the NVQ so we could advance to gas. I couldn’t find a plumber willing to take on a 40 year old apprentice at that time. So I ended up going self employed as a general plumber and occasionally I get to work with a well seasoned gas engineer and learn much of the old school tricks and tips from him. Still wish I could get my gas. Was thinking of doing my G3 as starting to see them more around here these days.

Do it. It will pay for itself in a single install. Make sure you get back on here (in the Arms) and learn about the realitys once ticketed though