Baxi 800 (with EvoHome)

[slicendice73]

Hi everyone

Newcomer here and freely admit to not knowing much about central heating or even plumbing in general tbh! I've got an old (20+ years) combi at the moment that is on its last legs (hot water is intermittent plus various faults over last 18 months). Consequently I'm looking to replace it with a new one and so have had various heating "people" in to quote. Needless to say, it's been brain overload and my head is spinning with all sorts of options, manufacturers, models, etc. I've tried to narrow it down to as much as I can and it's now down to two, one of which is a Baxi 800 (recommended by one local fitter). I like to find out about whatever I'm investing my hard earned cash in, but as the Baxi 800 appears to be quite new, there doesn't seem to lot of info out there about their performance, reliability, etc.

I believe Baxi are supposed to be reliable, plus it comes with a 10 year warranty, but I'm just wondering if anyone on here has had any experience of them or can give some feedback or opinions? Or is it more a case of "if it's installed and maintained properly, don't worry too much"?

I'm also going to be getting EvoHome - I believe Baxi support OpenTherm so, from what I understand, should play nicely with EvoHome. Again, just wondering if anyone's got experience of using a Baxi boiler with EvoHome (ideally an 800 but any Baxi if not)?

Thanks very much

 

[ShaunCorbs]

baxi 800 is just a baxi 600 with a filter and longer warranty

there decent boilers for the price be careful with opentherm i dont believe baxi support it 100%

 

[slicendice73]

baxi 800 is just a baxi 600 with a filter and longer warranty

there decent boilers for the price be careful with opentherm i dont believe baxi support it 100%

Many thanks for that Shaun...that's exactly the sort of info I was after re OpenTherm. EvoHome is not cheap and if I'm getting it then I want to make sure it works as well as it possibly can with the boiler I end up with.

 

[Aire]

baxi 800 is just a baxi 600 with a filter and longer warranty

there decent boilers for the price be careful with opentherm i dont believe baxi support it 100%

What do you mean by not fully supporting opentherm? The 600 and 800 do have an opentherm interface. I've never used the ports though so just curious incase it comes up in future.

 

[Brambles]

You cannot (easily) interface a Baxi 600 system boiler through the Open Therm Bridge to Evohome. You can interface a Baxi 600 Combi through Open Therm to Evohome.

However, in my experience, Evohome performs better with the Baxi 600 if it is configured conventionally through a wireless relay box. Even better if weather compensation is fitted too!

The reason for this is that Baxi Opentherm does not release sufficient functionality to Evohome to control the boiler as well as Baxi can. - Only my opinion, but I have seen Evohome in Open Therm mode work far better with other boilers ( Veissmann in particular ).

That is not a criticism of Baxi, it is just the Open Therm is not an identical comms language across all boiler manufacturers. Some manufacturers limit what the external controller can and cannot access.

On a separate note, unless you have a large property with rooms that are used on an irregular basis, Evohome is unlikely to offer savings to justify the installation cost. Evohome, gives (in my view) better local control a much better and consistent level of comfort - it is more of a luxury than an economy measure.

I should have added - there is no issue with trying Open Therm and reverting back to a wireless relay box to see what works best for you.

On a final note, choose the boiler that you feel most comfortable with - don’t make your decision purely because it configures well with Evohome.

I like Evohome, but it is old communications (albeit well proven) technology. At some point it will be superseded by a new none compatible Honeywell product.

 

[Aire]

As for the 800, it is just a 600 which has beem around a little longer, still fairly new though. I've installed a few and not had an issue yet. The components of both boilers have been used in the duotecs which have been around for years and are pretty reliable. I agree with Shaun, for the money they are a great boiler.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

What do you mean by not fully supporting opentherm? The 600 and 800 do have an opentherm interface. I've never used the ports though so just curious incase it comes up in future.

something about needing the hot water software aswell

"The 600 is opentherm but will only work with compatability opentherm controllers that have hot water control "

 

[Brambles]

I am very happy to share my experience - but I have tried to configure three Baxi 600’s (system boilers) with Evohome. I can (now) get it to work - but the performance is limited ( unexplained low flow temperature).

I think that some of the issue is the separation between the two channels ( DHW and CH). On the Combi version the single channel communication is very much easier to configure.

From a Customer perspective - it has to be plug and play first time - to make it a viable purchase.

Work in progress I am afraid

 

[slicendice73]

Thank you everyone for the input - very interesting stuff, although not sure it makes the decision any easier! ;-) It's a combi that I'm getting so, from the sound of your experiences Brambles, the 800 should (!) work OK with OpenTherm/EvoHome.

EvoHome is expensive, yes, but the reason I went for it is because I work from home and need to heat mainly just one room during the day, although there will be variations in this which, again, EvoHome seems well set up to handle. I'd also noted that the technology is relatively old, especially compared to some of the newer options, but it seems that, once it's set up correctly, it will just do it's thang until told to do otherwise. If it works, I'm inclined to leave it alone even if something newer and "better" comes along. I also like that EvoHome will continue to do its thang even if internet access drops, which I believe can be an issue for some of the newer alternatives.

The other option I'm looking at is an Intergas Xclusive, which I believe works really well with EvoHome.

 

[Brambles]

The Intergas Xclusive has twin RF ports - it is a very easy installation / configuration with the Evohome Opentherm Bridge.

 

[slicendice73]

The Intergas Xclusive has twin RF ports - it is a very easy installation / configuration with the Evohome Opentherm Bridge.

Funnily enough I was just reading up on that last night! Think that could swing things in favour of the Intergas!

 

[Gasmk1]

vaillant do something similar to the evo home

 

[slicendice73]

vaillant do something similar to the evo home

Yes, I believe it's their ambiSense product? Looks good but it appears to be even more expensive than EvoHome

 

[Brambles]

The Vaillant product is very easy to install, but it is only compatible with boilers that can be adapted to the Ebus interface. In essence if you subsequently change from a Vaillant boiler the interface becomes being quite complex. Having said that, if the boiler lasts 10 to 15 years, you will want a new control system after that time too!!

The only downside(s) I am aware of is the whole system ( including the controller) is battery powered.

I have only fitted two (Vaillant smart control systems) other Vaillant customers have opted for Evohome through the wireless interface and added weather compensation.

Why? Because some of the techy people who like these systems can easily add geofencing for multiple people and voice control to the Evohome interface.

It does not appeal to me, but you have to keep the customer satisfied!

 

[slicendice73]

...but you have to keep the customer satisfied!

Rule No. 1 in pretty much any business!!

 

[EvilDrPorkChop]

Evohome if you have the full system with TRVs is IMO the best on the market at the minute. I've fitted quite a few systems, along with having it in my own home and it's brilliant. Better comfort levels sell it alone but you'll also save some money on your gas bill.

If you're wanting to go down this route I wouldn't worry too much about the Opentherm, the system works just as well with the Relay box. Opentherm I don't always think suits every installation and I would advise accordingly. Unless you've got big double panel radiators and a relatively well insulated house to suit the lower flow temperatures then I don't see any benefit in Opentherm. As Brambles said if you wanted to use the Opentherm with the Baxi 800 and then revert to the wireless relay box instead then this is possible. You have to remember that Evohome will request 100% flow temperature if ANY zone is more than 1.5oc out so in reality if you've got a few radiators there's always going to be one or two that will be requesting full flow temp.

The more important thing is to get a boiler that has a larger modulation range if you are using Evohome, some will only modulate 1:4 of their output. So if you've only got 1 or 2 radiators on it'll cycle much more than a boiler that can modulate 1:6 or 1:10. The Vaillant GreenIQ range will do this and I always try to fit this to suit.

Vaillants controls are rubbish - we're accredited installers and even the rep says they have loads of trouble with them and the new TRVs. So much so the head guy in the UK has given up with the TRV heads. There's a new range of controls coming out soon i'm told...