Applying tile adhesive

[GrumpyGrampa]

Hi, I'm retired, not a plumber but a keen DIYer. I occasionally help a mate who is a one man band - he is a qualified sparky and has taught himself domestic plumbing. His main line of work is refurbishing bathrooms and I labour to him for a couple of days. We constantly disagree about applying tile adhesive to the walls prior to tiling - he "back butters" every tile which I think is mad, he says applying the adhesive directly to the wall doesn't work as it all falls off (??). We normally tile directly onto freshly erected plasterboard. Can someone help me convince him he's wrong?

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Depends on tiles but normally addy on wall with notched spread (notched to suite tiles) then back butter tiles then apply etc

 

[Scott_D]

I agree with the electrician

 

[GrumpyGrampa]

Depends on tiles but normally addy on wall with notched spread (notched to suite tiles) then back butter tiles then apply etc

Thanks for the reply. Do you mean apply adhesive to the wall and back butter each tile?

 

[townfanjon]

You would generally apply it to the wall with a notched trowel , the adhesive should cover 80/90% of the tile . Dabbing the back of the tile with dabs is not the correct way but is faster .
As for tiling straight onto plasterboard , again no , it needs plastering.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Thanks for the reply. Do you mean apply adhesive to the wall and back butter each tile?

Yes correct gives best coverage and strength

 

[townfanjon]

Yes correct gives best coverage and strength

Good god No . One or the other .

 

[Ben-gee]

Um - no.

Don’t plaster the plasterboard!

Some dodgy advice being given here- maybe move this to the tilers forum as if I tell you how to do it properly everyone will say how do I know - I’m just a plumber etc ( but I do know )

 

[townfanjon]

Um - no.

Don’t plaster the plasterboard!

Some dodgy advice being given here- maybe move this to the tilers forum as if I tell you how to do it properly everyone will say how do I know - I’m just a plumber etc ( but I do know )

Dont plaster the plasterboard , WTF !! sorry pal wrong 100%.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Dont plaster the plasterboard , WTF !! sorry pal wrong 100%.

Actually he’s right

Plastered plasterboard can hold around 7kgm2

Unplastered around 30kgm2

Ish

 

[townfanjon]

Plasterboard !!! , the name is the answer .

 

[rpm]

Um - no.

Don’t plaster the plasterboard!

Some dodgy advice being given here- maybe move this to the tilers forum as if I tell you how to do it properly everyone will say how do I know - I’m just a plumber etc ( but I do know )

No need move it, tilers discuss plumbing there.

 

[New Gas Engineer]

I always thought for a bathroom the waterproof membrane needs to go on the plasterboard and then the tiles or wall panels go on the membrane????

Called 'tanking' I think

 

[GrumpyGrampa]

Um - no.

Don’t plaster the plasterboard!

Some dodgy advice being given here- maybe move this to the tilers forum as if I tell you how to do it properly everyone will say how do I know - I’m just a plumber etc ( but I do know )

Thanks for the replies. Where do I find the "Tilers Forum" on this site?

 

[snowhead]

Ignore, Wont let me post a link

Follow link above to forum

 

[Dan]

You need to register there it's a separate website but the guys there rock when it comes to tiling.

 

[Ben-gee]

Grumpy; look if you’re going to take people’s hard earned money you ought to know what you’re doing....

In brief; yes tile directly onto plasterboard in none wet areas, wet areas either tank them or use a waterproof tiling board such as wedi, marmox, kerdi etc.

Apply adhesive to wall with notched trowel , notch size depends on tiles...

If tiles deeply studded or large or ‘bowed’ , also back butter the tile- in some cases will need to apply back of tile with notched trowel too.

Consider using a levelling system.

Consider getting a tiler in....

 

[leelister6]

Tiling on bare plasterboard is entirely acceptable in dry areas as bare plasterboard will bear a lot more weight than plastered (As mentioned above). In wet areas, a cement based board such as Hardibacker should be used. In both scenarios an SBR primer should be used. Never PVA.
As for adhesive application, on walls, one or the other methods can be used, both is a bit overkill but with floors it's generally best practice to apply adhesive to the prepared floor then back butter the tile for better coverage.

 

[GrumpyGrampa]

Grumpy; look if you’re going to take people’s hard earned money you ought to know what you’re doing..

In brief; yes tile directly onto plasterboard in none wet areas, wet areas either tank them or use a waterproof tiling board such as wedi, marmox, kerdi etc.

Apply adhesive to wall with notched trowel , notch size depends on tiles...

If tiles deeply studded or large or ‘bowed’ , also back butter the tile- in some cases will need to apply back of tile with notched trowel too.

Consider using a levelling system.

Consider getting a tiler in..

Ben-gee, I couldn't agree more as far as tiling in wet areas is concerned. I'm just a retired guy labouring to an old friend. I've watched several videos on how to tile a bathroom properly (Roger Bisby and others). If I showed my mate your advice he'd just shrug his shoulders and carry on doing what he's doing. Thanks again for taking the time to comment.

 

[townfanjon]

I will just like to clear this plaster , not plaster situation up .
I have always plastered every bathroom I have ever done , not one problem . The reason they should be plastered is you have a chance of removing tiles off a plastered wall you havent a hope in hell of removing tiles off a plasterboard wall that hasnt been plastered .
We have all been there just wanting to remove a couple of tiles for what ever reason and the whole wall collapses and creates a load more work .

 

[OffshoreGas]

Ben-gee, I couldn't agree more as far as tiling in wet areas is concerned. I'm just a retired guy labouring to an old friend. I've watched several videos on how to tile a bathroom properly (Roger Bisby and others). If I showed my mate your advice he'd just shrug his shoulders and carry on doing what he's doing. Thanks again for taking the time to comment.

I’m no tiling expert but the Skill Builder videos I’ve seen with Roger Bisby have been terrible. I’d take anything from them with a big pinch of salt.

Fundamentally your mate is the boss and the one footing the bill for any re-work. I’d just do as he asks.

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I will just like to clear this plaster , not plaster situation up .
I have always plastered every bathroom I have ever done , not one problem . The reason they should be plastered is you have a chance of removing tiles off a plastered wall you havent a hope in hell of removing tiles off a plasterboard wall that hasnt been plastered .
We have all been there just wanting to remove a couple of tiles for what ever reason and the whole wall collapses and creates a load more work .

A fair point

 

[townfanjon]

I’m no tiling expert but the Skill Builder videos I’ve seen with Roger Bisby have been terrible. I’d take anything from them with a big pinch of salt.

Fundamentally your mate is the boss and the one footing the bill for any re-work. I’d just do as he asks.

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A fair point

I went to sort a ball valve in a concealed cistern last week , some ******* had tiled the whole lot in with tiles stuck on plasterboard , absolute nightmare , the whole lot needs doing again . Pffftttttttt .

 

[Ben-gee]

I feel for you tfj, makes 1 hours work turn into two days.

My pet hate, and I think these t*ssers should be lined up and shot, are those that tile in a bath panel with no access “because it looks nicer”.

A bathroom showroom had promised a customer this look and I refused to do it leading to grief, the showroom guy was saying “ our taps won’t go wrong, our wastes won’t leak or block” I mean ffs.

 

[Dan]

Tiling on bare plasterboard is entirely acceptable in dry areas as bare plasterboard will bear a lot more weight than plastered (As mentioned above). In wet areas, a cement based board such as Hardibacker should be used. In both scenarios an SBR primer should be used. Never PVA.
As for adhesive application, on walls, one or the other methods can be used, both is a bit overkill but with floors it's generally best practice to apply adhesive to the prepared floor then back butter the tile for better coverage.

Plasterboard would need to be tanked if you tile in showers. It will fail eventually as the grout and adhesive are both porous.

 

[OffshoreGas]

Plasterboard would need to be tanked if you tile in showers. It will fail eventually as the grout and adhesive are both porous.

Even tanking is delaying the inevitable IMHO, I’d always use a substrate that’s not going to fail if it gets wet. Only the bits in a shower area obviously.

 

[leelister6]

Plasterboard would need to be tanked if you tile in showers. It will fail eventually as the grout and adhesive are both porous.

Even tanking is delaying the inevitable IMHO, I’d always use a substrate that’s not going to fail if it gets wet. Only the bits in a shower area obviously.

Did I not say to use Hardibacker in wet areas?!

 

[Dan]

Did I not say to use Hardibacker in wet areas?!

YES YOU DID!!!! -- My bad. I thought you said plasterboard is entirely acceptable to tile on....... and then I read showers somewhere pmsl.

That's scanning the forum outside a tile shop while waiting for some tiles to be delivered to my car for you!

So sorry! My bad.

 

[Dan]

Even tanking is delaying the inevitable IMHO, I’d always use a substrate that’s not going to fail if it gets wet. Only the bits in a shower area obviously.

Tanking is fine if done right. It never dissolves when wet. It'll last a lifetime. Well, longer than the cement-based adhesive will.

 

[OffshoreGas]

Tanking is fine if done right. It never dissolves when wet. It'll last a lifetime. Well, longer than the cement-based adhesive will.

Lots of ways to achieve the same result, each have our preferences.

Not mush difference in price, both do the same. Tankings got to be 100% correct, the various waterproof panels seem a bit more forgiving to me.

 

[Dan]

Lots of ways to achieve the same result, each have our preferences.

Not mush difference in price, both do the same. Tankings got to be 100% correct, the various waterproof panels seem a bit more forgiving to me.

Not the same price by a country mile.

Don't start trolling me, you'll regret it.

Panels need the scrim jointing, special screws, and can't be applied everywhere.

Tanking can do 10 showers and only needs tanking tape. And can be applied nearly everywhere.

Cost wise, if you divide the tanking by 10 showers, it's 10 times cheaper easy!

 

[Dan]

RIGHT PEOPLE THIS THREAD IS ABOUT APPLYING ADHESIVE - IF YOU WANT A TANKING THREAD - MAKE ONE!

 

[king of pipes]

Some good and bad advice posted chaps you would do yourselves some good joining the tiling forum I am a member of both , tiling methods have moved on alot over the last few years some master crafts men on there we can all learn from . Kop

 

[Mrb]

YES YOU DID!!!! -- My bad. I thought you said plasterboard is entirely acceptable to tile on... and then I read showers somewhere pmsl.

That's scanning the forum outside a tile shop while waiting for some tiles to be delivered to my car for you!

So sorry! My bad.

Hope your going to back butter your tiles @Dan
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Not sure why you would purposely introduce plaster skim to a wall that was to be tiled, sorry but that’s terrible advice.

OP get yourself over to the Tilers site for tiling advice.

 

[Dan]

Hope your going to back butter your tiles @Dan
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Not sure why you would purposely introduce plaster skim to a wall that was to be tiled, sorry but that’s terrible advice.

OP get yourself over to the Tilers site for tiling advice.

hahaha that went on a while eh lol Think I upset some people there lol